Discussion:
Al Gore betrayed America
(too old to reply)
John S. Dyson
2004-01-03 22:16:46 UTC
Permalink
Bush and Harris do not control county voting rolls.
No, Harris was simply empowered to enforce Florida
election law, law that Bush signed & funded.
Yes -- in some sense. However, Al Gore tried to keep
Harris from properly allowing the election process
to continue. He wouldn't let the certification
continue (which doesn't make the election final), and
allow him to gain standing to CONTEST the election.

Note that alot of the problems with the process were
DIRECTLY due to the incompetent management of the
Democrat managed precincts and the totally insane
abuses by Al Gore.

Al Gore tried to short circuit the system, and he did
other extra-constitutional and extra-legal things to
try to win. Al Gore got what he deserved -- he lost
because of VERY VERY bad sportsmanship and showing
the FACT that he was UNABLE to follow the law/precedent.

John
JTEM
2004-01-03 22:59:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
No, Harris was simply empowered to enforce Florida
election law, law that Bush signed & funded.
Yes -- in some sense.
In the "sense" that it was her frigging job! Is that what you
mean? It was her job to enforce all those election laws which
were broken.
Post by John S. Dyson
However, Al Gore tried to keep
Harris from properly allowing the election process
to continue.
http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=217&row=2

Oh, yes, Al Gore waved his magic wand and stopped the painted
whore from "certifying" results.

Please. Bush is an election thief, and unconstitutional pretender
to the office of President. He not only lost the popular vote
(including in Florida), but, because of the 12th amendment, he
can't even claim a constitutional victory.
John S. Dyson
2004-01-03 23:10:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by JTEM
Post by John S. Dyson
No, Harris was simply empowered to enforce Florida
election law, law that Bush signed & funded.
Yes -- in some sense.
In the "sense" that it was her frigging job! Is that what you
mean? It was her job to enforce all those election laws which
were broken.
However, Al Gore tried to keep
Harris from properly allowing the election process
to continue. Al Gore also tried to minimize the military
vote.
Post by JTEM
unconstitutional pretender
Thank God!!! Al Gore didn't succeed in his coup attempt against
the constitution.

John
Fear gan dia
2004-01-04 03:28:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
Post by John S. Dyson
No, Harris was simply empowered to enforce Florida
election law, law that Bush signed & funded.
Yes -- in some sense.
In the "sense" that it was her frigging job! Is that what you
mean? It was her job to enforce all those election laws which
were broken.
However, Al Gore tried to keep
Harris from properly allowing the election process
to continue. Al Gore also tried to minimize the military
vote.
Post by JTEM
unconstitutional pretender
Thank God!!! Al Gore didn't succeed in his coup attempt against
the constitution.
What an incredibly stupid moron you are.

--
Fear gan dia # http://goddamliberal.port5.com # U5 and proud of it!
WORK HARDER - millionaires on corporate welfare depend on you.
John S. Dyson
2004-01-04 21:28:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fear gan dia
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
Post by John S. Dyson
No, Harris was simply empowered to enforce Florida
election law, law that Bush signed & funded.
Yes -- in some sense.
In the "sense" that it was her frigging job! Is that what you
mean? It was her job to enforce all those election laws which
were broken.
However, Al Gore tried to keep
Harris from properly allowing the election process
to continue. Al Gore also tried to minimize the military
vote.
Post by JTEM
unconstitutional pretender
Thank God!!! Al Gore didn't succeed in his coup attempt against
the constitution.
What an incredibly stupid moron you are.
Remember: Al Gore tried to ascend to the presidency by using
the court system. That is NOT the constitutional methodology, and
would have caused a serious constitutional crisis. The courts
have NO CONSTITUTIONAL STANDING in ejudicating elections, especially
federal elections.

John
JTEM
2004-01-05 21:55:09 UTC
Permalink
We'll never forget.

Democracy died in Florida. We're sicking of mourning
it's loss. We want it back.
DemsHaveNoFriends
2004-01-05 22:40:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by JTEM
We'll never forget.
Democracy died in Florida. We're sicking of mourning
it's loss. We want it back.
The Democrat Party began to die in Florida. It's gotten worse since then,
and now the party is on life support. Soon you will be mourning its death,
at the rate things are going. Nobody wants the damn Democrat Party any
more.
JTEM
2004-01-04 07:24:23 UTC
Permalink
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam. George
Bush senior pulled strings to get his draft-dodging son
into the national guard, only to watch him desert his unit
the moment they began drug testing.

While poor & middle class Americans sacrificed life &
limb over in Vietnam, not taking drugs was too great of a
sacrifice for George Bush. It was too much for his country
to ask.

http://www.awolbush.com/

If our soldiers in Iraq ever look to George Bush for inspiration,
they'll be deserting in droves.

Shame on you, America, for allowing this disgrace to your
fighting men.

Shame on you, America, for allowing this to happen, for
allowing the Republicans to place a drug-chugging deserter
into the Whitehouse, despite him losing the election by more
than half a million votes.

Shame on you, America, for turning your backs on the more
than 50,000 Americans who served in Vietnam and never
saw their homes again.

Shame on you.
John S. Dyson
2004-01-04 21:26:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Al Gore took pictures, with personal security, in Vietnam

George Bush put on his uniform and learned to fly a plane
in the National Guard.
Post by JTEM
While poor & middle class Americans sacrificed life &
limb over in Vietnam
Al Gore had personal security and carried a camera.

Later on, Al Gore claimed that he saw action, thereby telling
a very disgusting lie. (Typical Clintonistic pervarication.)

Both George Bush and Al Gore were honorably discharged.

Later on, Al Gore dishonored his military brothers by substantially
impeding the counting of military votes and also telling
substantial lies about his personal past.

John
Jez
2004-01-04 22:46:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Al Gore took pictures, with personal security, in Vietnam
George Bush put on his uniform and learned to fly a plane
in the National Guard.
http://www.awolbush.com/

http://www.bushwatch.com/bushlies.htm
--
Ho hum
Jez
"Few of us can easily surrender our belief that
society must somehow make sense. The thought
that the State has lost its mind and is punishing so
many innocent people is intolerable. And so the
evidence has to be internally denied."
- Arthur Miller
King Pineapple
2004-01-05 01:42:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
http://www.bushwatch.com/bushlies.htm
--
Ho hum
Ho hum, indeed.

Tell us again why the military would "reward" a deserter by making him their
commander in chief.

GEORGE Magazine, October 15, 2000

The Real Military Record of George W. Bush: Not Heroic, but Not AWOL, Either
By Peter Keating and Karthik Thyagarajan


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----

For more than a year, controversy about George W. Bush's Air National Guard
record has bubbled through the press. Interest in the topic has spiked in
recent days, as at least two websites have launched stories essentially
calling Bush AWOL in 1972 and 1973. For example, in "Finally, the Truth
about Bush's Military Record" on TomPaine.com, Marty Heldt writes, "Bush's
long absence from the records comes to an end one week after he failed to
comply with an order to attend 'Annual Active Duty Training' starting at the
end of May 1973... Nothing indicates in the records that he ever made up the
time he missed." And in Bush's Military Record Reveals Grounding and Absence
for Two Full Years" on Democrats.com, Robert A. Rogers states: "Bush never
actually reported in person for the last two years of his service - in
direct violation of two separate written orders."

Neither is correct.

It's time to set the record straight. The following analysis, which relies
on National Guard documents, extensive interviews with military officials
and previously unpublished evidence of Bush's whereabouts in the summer and
fall of 1972, is the first full chronology of Bush's military record. Its
basic conclusions: Bush may have received favorable treatment to get into
the Guard, served irregularly after the spring of 1972 and got an expedited
discharge, but he did accumulate the days of service required of him for his
ultimate honorable discharge.



----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----

At the Republican convention in Philadelphia, George W. Bush declared: "Our
military is low on parts, pay and morale. If called on by the
commander-in-chief today, two entire divisions of the Army would have to
report, 'Not ready for duty, sir.'" Bush says he is the candidate who can
"rebuild our military and prepare our armed forces for the future." On what
direct military experience does he make such claims?

George W. Bush applied to join the Texas Air National Guard on May 27, 1968,
less than two weeks before he graduated from Yale University. The country
was at war in Vietnam, and at that time, just months after the bloody Tet
Offensive, an estimated 100,000 Americans were on waiting lists to join
Guard units across the country. Bush was sworn in on the day he applied.

Ben Barnes, former speaker of the Texas House of Representatives, stated in
September 1999 that in late 1967 or early 1968, he asked a senior official
in the Texas Air National Guard to help Bush get into the Guard as a pilot.
Barnes said he did so at the behest of Sidney Adger, a Houston businessman
and friend of former President George H. W. Bush, then a Texas congressman.
Despite Barnes's admission, former President Bush has denied pulling strings
for his son, and retired Colonel Walter Staudt, George W. Bush's first
commander, insists: "There was no special treatment."

The younger Bush fulfilled two years of active duty and completed pilot
training in June 1970. During that time and in the two years that followed,
Bush flew the F-102, an interceptor jet equipped with heat-seeking missiles
that could shoot down enemy planes. His commanding officers and peers
regarded Bush as a competent pilot and enthusiastic Guard member. In March
1970, the Texas Air National Guard issued a press release trumpeting his
performance: "Lt. Bush recently became the first Houston pilot to be trained
by the 147th [Fighter Group] and to solo in the F-102... Lt. Bush said his
father was just as excited and enthusiastic about his solo flight as he
was." In Bush's evaluation for the period May 1, 1971 through April 30,
1972, then-Colonel Bobby Hodges, his commanding officer, stated, "I have
personally observed his participation, and without exception, his
performance has been noteworthy." In the spring of 1972, however, National
Guard records show a sudden dropoff in Bush's military activity. Though
trained as a pilot at considerable government expense, Bush stopped flying
in April 1972 and never flew for the Guard again.

Around that time, Bush decided to go to work for Winton "Red" Blount, a
Republican running for the U.S. Senate, in Alabama. Documents from Ellington
Air Force Base in Houston state that Bush "cleared this base on 15 May."
Shortly afterward, he applied for assignment to the 9921st Air Reserve
Squadron in Montgomery, Ala., a unit that required minimal duty and offered
no pay. Although that unit's commander was willing to welcome him, on May 31
higher-ups at the Air Reserve Personnel Center in Denver rejected Bush's
request to serve at the 9921st, because it did not offer duty equivalent to
his service in Texas. "[A]n obligated Reservist [in this case, Bush] can be
assigned to a specific Ready Reserve position only," noted the disapproval
memo, a copy of which was sent to Bush. "Therefore, he is ineligible for
assignment to an Air Reserve Squadron."

Despite the military's decision, Bush moved to Alabama. Records obtained by
Georegemag.com show that the Blount Senate campaign paid Bush about $900 a
month from mid-May through mid-November to do advance work and organize
events. Neither Bush's annual evaluation nor the Air National Guard's
overall chronological listing of his service contain any evidence that he
performed Guard duties during that summer.

On or around his 27th birthday, July 6, 1972, Bush did not take his required
annual medical exam at his Texas unit. As a consequence, he was suspended
from flying military jets. Bush spokesperson Dan Bartlett told
Georgemag.com: "You take that exam because you are flying, and he was not
flying. The paperwork uses the phrase 'suspended from flying,' but he had no
intention of flying at that time."

Some media reports have speculated that Bush took and failed his physical,
or that he was grounded as a result of substance abuse. Bush's vagueness on
the subject of his past drug use has only abetted such rumors. Bush's
commanding officer in Texas, however, denies the charges. "His flying status
was suspended because he didn't take the exam,not because he couldn't pass,"
says Hodges. Asked whether Bush was ever disciplined for using alcohol or
illicit drugs, Hodges replied: "No."

On September 5, Bush wrote to then-Colonel Jerry Killian at his original
unit in Texas, requesting permission to serve with the 187th Tactical
Reconnaisance Group, another Alabama-based unit. "This duty would be for the
months of September, October, and November," wrote Bush.

This time his request was approved: 10 days later, the Alabama Guard ordered
Bush to report to then-Lieutenant Colonel William Turnipseed at Dannelly Air
Force Base in Montgomery on October 7th and 8th. The memo noted that
"Lieutenant Bush will not be able to satisfy his flight requirements with
our group," since the 187th did not fly F-102s.

The question of whether Bush ever actually served in Alabama has become an
issue in the 2000 campaign-the Air Force Times recently reported that "the
GOP is trying to locate people who served with Bush in late 1972 ... to see
if they can confirm that Bush briefly served with the Alabama Air National
Guard." Bush's records contain no evidence that he reported to Dannelly in
October. And in telephone interviews with Georgemag.com, neither Turnipseed,
Bush's commanding officer, nor Kenneth Lott, then chief personnel officer of
the 187th, remembered Bush serving with their unit. "I don't think he showed
up," Turnipseed said.

Bush maintains he did serve in Alabama. "Governor Bush specifically
remembers pulling duty in Montgomery and respectfully disagrees with the
Colonel," says Bartlett. "There's no question it wasn't memorable, because
he wasn't flying." In July, the Decatur Daily reported that two former
Blount campaign workers recall Bush serving in the Alabama Air National
Guard in the fall of 1972. "I remember he actually came back to Alabama for
about a week to 10 days several weeks after the campaign was over to
complete his Guard duty in the state," stated Emily Martin, a former Alabama
resident who said she dated Bush during the time he spent in that state.

After the 1972 election, which Blount lost, Bush moved back to Houston and
subsequently began working at P.U.L.L., a community service center for
disadvantaged youths. This period of time has also become a matter of
controversy, because even though Bush's original unit had been placed on
alert duty in October 1972, his superiors in Texas lost track of his
whereabouts. On May 2, 1973, Bush's squadron leader in the 147th, Lieutenant
Colonel William Harris, Jr. wrote: "Lt. Bush has not been observed at this
unit" for the past year. Harris incorrectly assumed that Bush had been
reporting for duty in Alabama all along. He wrote that Bush "has been
performing equivalent training in a non-flying status with the 187 Tac Recon
Gp, Dannelly ANG Base, Alabama." Base commander Hodges says of Bush's return
to Texas: "All I remember is someone saying he came back and made up his
days."

Two documents obtained by Georgemag.com indicate that Bush did make up the
time he missed during the summer and autumn of 1972. One is an April 23,
1973 order for Bush to report to annual active duty training the following
month; the other is an Air National Guard statement of days served by Bush
that is torn and undated but contains entries that correspond to the first.
Taken together, they appear to establish that Bush reported for duty on nine
occasions between November 29, 1972-when he could have been in Alabama-and
May 24, 1973. Bush still wasn't flying, but over this span, he did earn nine
points of National Guard service from days of active duty and 32 from
inactive duty. When added to the 15 so-called "gratuitous" points that every
member of the Guard got per year, Bush accumulated 56 points, more than the
50 that he needed by the end of May 1973 to maintain his standing as a
Guardsman.

On May 1, Bush was ordered to report for further active duty training, and
documents show that he proceeded to cram in another 10 sessions over the
next two months. Ultimately, he racked up 19 active duty points of service
and 16 inactive duty points by July 30-which, added to his 15 gratuitous
points, achieved the requisite total of 50 for the year ending in May 1974.

On October 1, 1973, First Lieutenant George W. Bush received an early
honorable discharge so that he could attend Harvard Business School. He was
credited with five years, four months and five days of service toward his
six-year service obligation



"You can change the outcome of any election you want" -Bill Clinton
JTEM
2004-01-05 05:57:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by King Pineapple
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
http://www.bushwatch.com/bushlies.htm
--
Ho hum
Tell us again why the military would "reward" a deserter by
making him their commander in chief.
They didn't. The military is slave to the mafia. It's their job to
take orders & die, not to ask questions.

As long as the military keeps protecting the war profiteers, and
accepts all the blame when Rumsfeld screws up, the mafia is
happy. And, when the mafia is happy, people like Colin Powell
retire from the military as multi millionaires.

You didn't think it was his military pay that "earned" him his
fortune, did you?

That's funny!
King Pineapple
2004-01-05 18:44:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by JTEM
Post by King Pineapple
Tell us again why the military would "reward" a deserter by
making him their commander in chief.
They didn't. The military is slave to the mafia. It's their job to
take orders & die, not to ask questions.
Congratulations. You're the 176th person who's tried to answer my challenge
and failed.

Such idiocy. You obviously know NOTHING about the military...




"It helps when you criticize other peoples grammer to have you own in
order. Otherwise you look like an ass".
Leading NG dem John Willimans
JTEM
2004-01-05 20:22:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by King Pineapple
Post by JTEM
The military is slave to the mafia. It's their job to
take orders & die, not to ask questions.
Congratulations.
We all win with the truth.
Osama Bush Laden
2004-01-05 15:47:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by King Pineapple
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
http://www.bushwatch.com/bushlies.htm
--
Ho hum
Ho hum, indeed.
Tell us again why the military would "reward" a deserter by making him their
commander in chief.
King Pissant, tell us how the military figures in the choosing of the
commander in chief.
King Pineapple
2004-01-05 18:46:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Osama Bush Laden
King Pissant, tell us how the military figures in the choosing of the
commander in chief.
Uh, ask Algore. He tried to get the military absentee votes thrown out in
Floriduh. He certainly wouldn't do that if they were voting for HIM, would
he?

The American military's Officer Corps is 7 to 1 Republican. A majority of
the enlisted Corps is also Republican, though not as wide of a margin
(40-30?)



"You can change the outcome of any election you want" -Bill Clinton
JTEM
2004-01-05 20:22:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by King Pineapple
Uh, ask Algore. He tried to get the military absentee votes
thrown out in Floriduh.
Cites, please.

Thanks in advance.
John S. Dyson
2004-01-05 06:32:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Al Gore took pictures, with personal security, in Vietnam
George Bush put on his uniform and learned to fly a plane
in the National Guard.
Dishonest sites like those against Bush don't do justice to
the fact that it is clear that Al Gore took pictures, had
his own security, yet claimed that he saw action (but through
a lens.) Maybe Al Gore saw action through the lens of his
camera, or perhaps participated in 'action' in entertainment
districts?

George Bush did learn to fly a plane (while it is probable that
Al Gore didn't have the physical/mental ability to fly a plane.)
Al Gore was even given a security team to take care of him
(probably drove him around Saigon or even the various entertainment
facilities.)

There is no evidence from respectable sources against Bush,
and Bush did leave the military with an honorable discharge.

Even if Bush did something wrong in his past, he is doing
VERY VERY good while protecting us now. He has even compensated
for the sins that the dishonest Demwits claim that he has
done.

BTW, for the issue of discharges -- I don't even want to
think about BJ Clinton's infectious discharge.

John
Thom
2004-01-05 12:36:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Al Gore took pictures, with personal security, in Vietnam
George Bush put on his uniform and learned to fly a plane
in the National Guard.
Dishonest sites like those against Bush don't do justice to
the fact that it is clear that Al Gore took pictures, had
his own security, yet claimed that he saw action (but through
a lens.) Maybe Al Gore saw action through the lens of his
camera, or perhaps participated in 'action' in entertainment
districts?
The photo recon people in my outfit faced real MIGs while Bush faced
his drinking and drug problem.

Not counting AAA fire (we lost 54% of our plabes in the war) we lost 2
RF-101's (both the same day) and 4 RF-4C's just in the time I was
there (66-67). one body was never found and 9 of the crew spent the
rest of the war facing the Hanoi Hilton. The worst Bush faced was a
huge bar bill at the "O-Club".
Post by John S. Dyson
George Bush did learn to fly a plane (while it is probable that
Al Gore didn't have the physical/mental ability to fly a plane.)
Really? And you say his medical evaluations when?
Post by John S. Dyson
Al Gore was even given a security team to take care of him
(probably drove him around Saigon or even the various entertainment
facilities.)
anip
Post by John S. Dyson
John
I don't want to waste time reiterating the real story about photo
people in Nam. But I have more. If you knew anything about anything
you would know the AF people were at Ton Son Nhute (Saigon). Army
photo people were at Long Bin, not Saigon. Entertainers carried their
own people for coverage especially the Bob Hope Show. Bob hope played
for the troops in enemy country at big bases and little outposts,
sometimes under the eyes of the enemy. George didn't do squat except
hide from the war.

Care to make a bigger fool of yourself draft dodger?

THOM
RVN 1966-67
DemsHaveNoFriends
2004-01-05 13:20:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thom
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Al Gore took pictures, with personal security, in Vietnam
George Bush put on his uniform and learned to fly a plane
in the National Guard.
Dishonest sites like those against Bush don't do justice to
the fact that it is clear that Al Gore took pictures, had
his own security, yet claimed that he saw action (but through
a lens.) Maybe Al Gore saw action through the lens of his
camera, or perhaps participated in 'action' in entertainment
districts?
The photo recon people in my outfit faced real MIGs while Bush faced
Gore wasn't in "photo recon". But yes, Gore had a camera during the Vietnam
war, while Bush flew fighter jets.
Anonymous
2004-01-05 14:40:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thom
The photo recon people in my outfit faced real MIGs while Bush faced
Gore wasn't in "photo recon". But yes, Gore had a camera during the Vietnam
war, while Bush flew fighter jets.
The photo recon people in my outfit faced real MIGs while Bush faced...
===============================================
Now, Republicans have a ton of things to investigate concerning
Appointee "W and Company," but they will block any indepth Genuine
investigations!

Planes of 911 Exceeded Their Software Limits
by Jim Heikkila Saturday August 17, 2002

Two of the aircraft exceeded their software limits on 9/11.
The Boeing 757 and 767 are equipped with fully autonomous flight
capability, they are the only two Boeing commuter aircraft capable of
fully autonomous flight. They can be programmed to take off, fly to a
destination and land, completely without a pilot at the controls.

They are intelligent planes, and have software limits pre set so that
pilot error cannot cause passenger injury. Though they are physically
capable of high g maneuvers, the software in their flight control
systems prevents high g maneuvers from being performed via the cockpit
controls. They are limited to approximately 1.5 g's, I repeat, one and
one half g's. This is so that a pilot mistake cannot end up breaking
grandma's neck.

No matter what the pilot wants, he cannot override this feature.

The plane that hit the Pentagon approached or reached its actual
physical limits, military personnel have calculated that the Pentagon
plane pulled between five and seven g's in its final turn.

The same is true for the second aircraft to impact the WTC.
There is only one way this can happen.

As well as fully autonomous flight capability, the 767 and 757 are the
ONLY COMMUTER PLANES MADE BY BOEING THAT CAN BE FLOWN VIA REMOTE
CONTROL. It is a feature that is standard to all of them, all 757's and
767's can do it. The purpose for this is if there is a problem with the
pilots, Norad can fly the planes to safe destinations via remote. Only
in this flight mode can those craft exceed their software limits and
perform to their actual physical limits because a pre existing emergency
situation is assumed if this mode of flight is used.

Terrorists in fact did not fly those planes, it is totally and
completely impossible for those planes to have been flown in such a
manner from the cockpit. Those are commuter aircraft, not F-16's and
their software knows it.

Another piece of critical evidence: the voice recorders came up blank.

The flight recorders that were recovered had tape that was undamaged
inside, but it was blank. There is only one way this can happen on a
757 or 767. When the aircraft are commandeered via remote control, the
microphones that go to the cockpit voice recorder are re routed to the
people doing the remote controlling, so that the recording of what
happened in the cockpit gets made in a presumably safer place. But due
to a glitch in the system on a 757/767, rather than shutting off when
the mic is redirected the voice recorder keeps running. The voice
recorders use what is called a continuous loop tape, which automatically
re passes itself past the erase and record heads once every half hour,
so after a half hour of running with the microphones redirected, the
tape will be blank. Just like the recovered tapes were. Yet more proof
that no pilot flew those planes in the last half hour.

Eight of the hijackers who were on those planes called up complaining
that they were still alive. I'd bet you never heard about our foreign
minister flying to Morocco and issuing an official apology to the
accused, did you? No, terrorists did not fly those planes, plastic
knives and box cutters were in fact too ridiculous to be true. Any of
the remaining accused have certainly been sought out and killed by now.

Our information IS controlled
The cell phone calls from the aircraft could not have happened. I am a
National Security Agency trained Electronic Warfare specialist, and am
qualified to say this. My official title: MOS33Q10, Electronic Warfare
Intercept Strategic Signal Processing/Storage Systems Specialist, a
highly skilled MOS which requires advanced knowledge of many
communications methods and circuits to the most minute level. I am
officially qualified to place severe doubt that ordinary cell phone
calls were ever made from the aircraft.

It was impossible for that to have happened, especially in a rural area
for a number of reasons.
When you make a cell phone call, the first thing that happens is that
your cell phone needs to contact a transponder. Your cell phone has a
max transmit power of five watts, three watts is actually the norm. If
an aircraft is going five hundred miles an hour, your cell phone will
not be able to 1. Contact a tower, 2. Tell the tower who you are, and
who your provider is, 3. Tell the tower what mode it wants to
communicate with, and 4. Establish that it is in a roaming area before
it passes out of a five watt range. This procedure, called an electronic
handshake, takes approximately 45 seconds for a cell phone to complete
upon initial power up in a roaming area because neither the cell phone
or cell transponder knows where that phone is and what mode it uses when
it is turned on. At 500 miles an hour, the aircraft will travel three
times the range of a cell phone's five watt transmitter before this
handshaking can occur. Though it is sometimes possible to connect during
takeoff and landing, under the situation that was claimed the calls were
impossible. The calls from the airplane were faked, no if's or buts.

I hope I made sense, if you have questions I will respond if possible.
If I do not respond, please research this out yourself, search the
boeing site, search the DARPA site, search were you have not searched
before. Some of the information is classified and leaked by individuals,
and it is also being scoured from the net. I have all of the original
documents on my computer to safeguard against this.

Please do not ignore this, because only Norad has the flight codes for
those aircraft, we did 911 ourselves. Hitler had the Reichstag, we have
911. If 911 proves to not be enough to make the US citizenry set aside
its rights for safety, the people who did 911 most certainly have access
to nuclear material. 911 must be exposed for what it was before that
material is used."
===========================================================
I had nothing to do with the above article, --however, will it be
verified or discredited by reliable independent sources.

Is the above article factually correct concerning software control and
the black boxes? The cell phone issue is rather immaterial because the
hijacker's could have wanted to take over the airliners so they could
hold the passengers hostage to trade for prisoners they wanted released.

However, if the Boeing 757 and 767 fully autonomous flight capability
took over they would end up precisely where they did, while serving the
objectives of the controllers.

http://boards.marihemp.com/boards/msg1x51754.shtml

http://abcnews.go.com/sections/nightline/DailyNews/pnac_030310.html

http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/timeline/main/essayaninterestingday.html

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/12/17/eveningnews/main589137.shtml

http://www.911forthetruth.com/

http://www.americanfreepress.net/051302/FBI_Admits__No_Evidence_/fbi_admits__no_evidence_.html
Jim
2004-01-05 19:56:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Anonymous
Post by Thom
The photo recon people in my outfit faced real MIGs while Bush faced
Gore wasn't in "photo recon". But yes, Gore had a camera during the Vietnam
war, while Bush flew fighter jets.
The photo recon people in my outfit faced real MIGs while Bush faced...
===============================================
Now, Republicans have a ton of things to investigate concerning
Appointee "W and Company," but they will block any indepth Genuine
investigations!
Planes of 911 Exceeded Their Software Limits
by Jim Heikkila Saturday August 17, 2002
Two of the aircraft exceeded their software limits on 9/11.
The Boeing 757 and 767 are equipped with fully autonomous flight
capability, they are the only two Boeing commuter aircraft capable of
fully autonomous flight.
That is, until the pilot, or whoever is sitting in the pilot's seat,
flips the switch to the OFF position.

Jim
John S. Dyson
2004-01-05 20:27:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Anonymous
Post by Thom
The photo recon people in my outfit faced real MIGs while Bush faced
Gore wasn't in "photo recon". But yes, Gore had a camera during the Vietnam
war, while Bush flew fighter jets.
The photo recon people in my outfit faced real MIGs while Bush faced...
===============================================
Now, Republicans have a ton of things to investigate concerning
Appointee "W and Company,"
Remember that Al Gore tried to get the courts to ejudicate the
election, and take the election away from the Constitutional
process.

John
USA
2004-01-06 00:44:54 UTC
Permalink
Yes, the Bush family made its fortune supporting Nazism, and
the family friend Kennyboy Lay bought little wimp Dubya a trip
to the oval office. America lost, bigtime, as a result.

http://www.ericblumrich.com/gta.html
qwerty
2004-01-05 17:29:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Gore wasn't in "photo recon".
Gore was in Vietnam and was in far more peril from the enemy than Bush was
back in Texas. Note: Aviation groupies, booze & barroom floors don't count
as the "enemy"!
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
But yes, Gore had a camera during the Vietnam
war, while Bush flew fighter jets.
Bush flew obsolete F-102's that were well along on being phased out of all
military use when he first started training. I suppose if one trained in a
Fokker tri-plane, Jenny or Sopwith Camel one could be considered to be
flying a fighter plane too.
Brooks Gregory
2004-01-05 17:34:52 UTC
Permalink
What is the purpose of this argument? What difference does any of it make
to the general course of human events in this day and time? Are you guys
just so bored this is all you can think of to fuss about? Geez, grow up!
--
In politics, it's a very simple concept.
If you don't vote, you don't count.

Brooks Gregory
DemsHaveNoFriends
2004-01-05 18:19:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by qwerty
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Gore wasn't in "photo recon".
Gore was in Vietnam and was in far more peril from the enemy than Bush was
back in Texas.
Big deal. Ted Kennedy was drunk on Martha's Vineyard and was in far more
peril from Demon Rum (witness the tragic death of MaryJo Kopechne at the
hands of the drunken Ted) than Gore was, but that hardly means that Ted
Kennedy is therefore a war hero.

Besides, Bush flew fighter jets, while Gore merely took pictures.
qwerty
2004-01-05 18:40:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Post by qwerty
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Gore wasn't in "photo recon".
Gore was in Vietnam and was in far more peril from the enemy than Bush was
back in Texas.
Big deal. Ted Kennedy was drunk on Martha's Vineyard and was in far more
peril from Demon Rum (witness the tragic death of MaryJo Kopechne at the
hands of the drunken Ted) than Gore was, but that hardly means that Ted
Kennedy is therefore a war hero.
LOL, go look up the logical fallacy known as a "Red Herring".
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Besides, Bush flew fighter jets, while Gore merely took pictures.
Gore went to Vietnam even though he opposed the War, Bush flew obsolete
airplanes with no chance of going to Vietnam, stayed home, chased aviation
groupies and flopped around on barroom floors!
Bob
2004-01-05 18:43:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by qwerty
Gore went to Vietnam even though he opposed the War,
Apparently not a man of his convictions. More than likely, it was politically
motivated.
Post by qwerty
Bush flew obsolete
airplanes with no chance of going to Vietnam, stayed home, chased aviation
groupies and flopped around on barroom floors!
Bush probably used means not available to most of the unwashed to avoid Vietnam.
qwerty
2004-01-05 18:58:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
Gore went to Vietnam even though he opposed the War,
Apparently not a man of his convictions.
Really? He felt obligated to serve his country despite his personal doubts
about the war.
Post by Bob
More than likely, it was politically
motivated.
Proof?
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
Bush flew obsolete
airplanes with no chance of going to Vietnam, stayed home, chased aviation
groupies and flopped around on barroom floors!
Bush probably used means not available to most of the unwashed to avoid Vietnam.
Indeed.
DemsHaveNoFriends
2004-01-05 20:12:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by qwerty
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
Gore went to Vietnam even though he opposed the War,
Apparently not a man of his convictions.
Really? He felt obligated to serve his country despite his personal doubts
about the war.
Which draws into question Gore's effectiveness as a fighting machine....
Bob
2004-01-05 20:51:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by qwerty
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
Gore went to Vietnam even though he opposed the War,
Apparently not a man of his convictions.
Really? He felt obligated to serve his country despite his personal doubts
about the war.
And ignore his conviction of opposition to the war.
Post by qwerty
Post by Bob
More than likely, it was politically
motivated.
Proof?
I have none. It's an opinion.
qwerty
2004-01-05 20:56:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
Gore went to Vietnam even though he opposed the War,
Apparently not a man of his convictions.
Really? He felt obligated to serve his country despite his personal doubts
about the war.
And ignore his conviction of opposition to the war.
You mean serve his country and fullfill his obligations.
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
Post by Bob
More than likely, it was politically
motivated.
Proof?
I have none. It's an opinion.
Thanks for admitting that! You've no proof of any of your silly
allegations.
DemsHaveNoFriends
2004-01-05 22:08:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by qwerty
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
Gore went to Vietnam even though he opposed the War,
Apparently not a man of his convictions.
Really? He felt obligated to serve his country despite his personal
doubts
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
about the war.
And ignore his conviction of opposition to the war.
You mean serve his country and fullfill his obligations.
With a camera. Meanwhile, Bush fulfilled HIS obligation to his country by
flying fighter jets.
qwerty
2004-01-06 00:18:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Post by qwerty
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
Gore went to Vietnam even though he opposed the War,
Apparently not a man of his convictions.
Really? He felt obligated to serve his country despite his personal
doubts
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
about the war.
And ignore his conviction of opposition to the war.
You mean serve his country and fullfill his obligations.
With a camera.
In Vietnam, which was a war area.
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Meanwhile, Bush fulfilled HIS obligation to his country by
flying fighter jets.
Bush flew obsolete F-102's with NO CHANCE of going to Vietnam or seeing any
combat.
DemsHaveNoFriends
2004-01-06 02:40:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by qwerty
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Post by qwerty
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
Gore went to Vietnam even though he opposed the War,
Apparently not a man of his convictions.
Really? He felt obligated to serve his country despite his personal
doubts
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
about the war.
And ignore his conviction of opposition to the war.
You mean serve his country and fullfill his obligations.
With a camera.
In Vietnam, which was a war area.
So how many of the enemy did Gore kill with his camera?
Joe S.
2004-01-06 00:48:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Post by qwerty
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
Gore went to Vietnam even though he opposed the War,
Apparently not a man of his convictions.
Really? He felt obligated to serve his country despite his personal
doubts
Post by Bob
Post by qwerty
about the war.
And ignore his conviction of opposition to the war.
You mean serve his country and fullfill his obligations.
With a camera. Meanwhile, Bush fulfilled HIS obligation to his country by
flying fighter jets.
Gore was an Army journalist IN VIETNAM.

Bush completed basic flight training -- not combat training -- that's a
whole separate course of training -- in an obsolete aircraft AND HE NEVER
LEFT TEXAS.
--
----

Joe S.
DemsHaveNoFriends
2004-01-06 02:40:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Joe S.
Gore was an Army journalist IN VIETNAM.
Bush completed basic flight training -- not combat training -- that's a
whole separate course of training -- in an obsolete aircraft AND HE NEVER
LEFT TEXAS.
Let's just put it this way, Joe:


Both Clinton and Bush never served their country in Vietnam, and both of
them were elected President. Gore served his country in Vietnam (taking
pictures with his shiny new camera) and couldn't get elected President.


That's a fair and accurate statement of the facts, isn't it Joe?
DemsHaveNoFriends
2004-01-05 18:48:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by qwerty
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Post by qwerty
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Gore wasn't in "photo recon".
Gore was in Vietnam and was in far more peril from the enemy than Bush
was
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Post by qwerty
back in Texas.
Big deal. Ted Kennedy was drunk on Martha's Vineyard and was in far more
peril from Demon Rum (witness the tragic death of MaryJo Kopechne at the
hands of the drunken Ted) than Gore was, but that hardly means that Ted
Kennedy is therefore a war hero.
LOL, go look up the logical fallacy known as a "Red Herring".
I guess you should have thought to do that yourself before you brought up
your "in far more peril" red herring?
qwerty
2004-01-05 18:53:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Post by qwerty
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Post by qwerty
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Gore wasn't in "photo recon".
Gore was in Vietnam and was in far more peril from the enemy than Bush
was
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Post by qwerty
back in Texas.
Big deal. Ted Kennedy was drunk on Martha's Vineyard and was in far
more
Post by qwerty
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
peril from Demon Rum (witness the tragic death of MaryJo Kopechne at the
hands of the drunken Ted) than Gore was, but that hardly means that Ted
Kennedy is therefore a war hero.
LOL, go look up the logical fallacy known as a "Red Herring".
I guess you should have thought to do that yourself before you brought up
your "in far more peril" red herring?
As oppossed the implied "photo recon" (less dangerous) remark compared to
the "flying jets" (more dangerous)?
John S. Dyson
2004-01-05 20:29:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by qwerty
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
I guess you should have thought to do that yourself before you brought up
your "in far more peril" red herring?
As oppossed the implied "photo recon" (less dangerous) remark compared to
the "flying jets" (more dangerous)?
Actually, Gore probably took pictures for photo albums, and it isnt'
clear that he had an honorable discharge.

Bush flew planes and was honorably discharged.

John
qwerty
2004-01-05 20:51:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by qwerty
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
I guess you should have thought to do that yourself before you brought up
your "in far more peril" red herring?
As oppossed the implied "photo recon" (less dangerous) remark compared to
the "flying jets" (more dangerous)?
Actually, Gore probably took pictures for photo albums, and it isnt'
clear that he had an honorable discharge.
It isn't clear? You have evidence that Gore didn't receive an honorable
discharge?
Post by John S. Dyson
Bush flew planes and was honorably discharged.
Gee, what happened to his flight status? Why did he lose it?
Harry Grogan
2004-01-05 21:39:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Post by Thom
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Al Gore took pictures, with personal security, in Vietnam
George Bush put on his uniform and learned to fly a plane
in the National Guard.
Dishonest sites like those against Bush don't do justice to
the fact that it is clear that Al Gore took pictures, had
his own security, yet claimed that he saw action (but through
a lens.) Maybe Al Gore saw action through the lens of his
camera, or perhaps participated in 'action' in entertainment
districts?
The photo recon people in my outfit faced real MIGs while Bush faced
Gore wasn't in "photo recon". But yes, Gore had a camera during the Vietnam
war, while Bush flew fighter jets.
Alpha Gore was a REMF!!He never heard a shot fired.
Joe S.
2004-01-06 00:47:11 UTC
Permalink
Al Gore was an Army journalist IN VIETNAM. He had no security detail.

GWBush completed basic flight training in an obsolete aircraft AND NEVER
LEFT TEXAS.
--
----
Joe S.
Post by Harry Grogan
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Post by Thom
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Al Gore took pictures, with personal security, in Vietnam
George Bush put on his uniform and learned to fly a plane
in the National Guard.
Dishonest sites like those against Bush don't do justice to
the fact that it is clear that Al Gore took pictures, had
his own security, yet claimed that he saw action (but through
a lens.) Maybe Al Gore saw action through the lens of his
camera, or perhaps participated in 'action' in entertainment
districts?
The photo recon people in my outfit faced real MIGs while Bush faced
Gore wasn't in "photo recon". But yes, Gore had a camera during the Vietnam
war, while Bush flew fighter jets.
Alpha Gore was a REMF!!He never heard a shot fired.
DemsHaveNoFriends
2004-01-06 02:40:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Joe S.
Al Gore was an Army journalist IN VIETNAM. He had no security detail.
GWBush completed basic flight training in an obsolete aircraft AND NEVER
LEFT TEXAS.
Let's just put it this way, Joe:

Bush killed as many of the enemy in Vietnam with his fighter jet as Gore
killed with his camera.

That's a fair and accurate statement of the facts, isn't it?
John S. Dyson
2004-01-05 21:44:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thom
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Al Gore took pictures, with personal security, in Vietnam
George Bush put on his uniform and learned to fly a plane
in the National Guard.
Dishonest sites like those against Bush don't do justice to
the fact that it is clear that Al Gore took pictures, had
his own security, yet claimed that he saw action (but through
a lens.) Maybe Al Gore saw action through the lens of his
camera, or perhaps participated in 'action' in entertainment
districts?
The photo recon people in my outfit faced real MIGs
Al Gore took military newspaper pictures... He was apparently
a military journalist, not a spy. Gore took pictures that
any wussy could take, but Bush flew planes.

Question: do you have proof that Al Gore had an honorable
discharge?

John
Thom
2004-01-05 23:17:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by Thom
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Al Gore took pictures, with personal security, in Vietnam
George Bush put on his uniform and learned to fly a plane
in the National Guard.
Dishonest sites like those against Bush don't do justice to
the fact that it is clear that Al Gore took pictures, had
his own security, yet claimed that he saw action (but through
a lens.) Maybe Al Gore saw action through the lens of his
camera, or perhaps participated in 'action' in entertainment
districts?
The photo recon people in my outfit faced real MIGs
Al Gore took military newspaper pictures... He was apparently
a military journalist, not a spy. Gore took pictures that
any wussy could take, but Bush flew planes.
all photo people over there did photo journalism work, its part of the
AFSC. And "apparently"? I thought you knew all about the man? And
as far as Wussy is concerned I see you have the usual right wing
disdane for the average soldier. Bush flew planes? Yup until he got
grounded for refusing to take a blood test. Nor did he ever fly them
anyplace but Wussy/Pussy Texas. At least Gore was in nam. How many
F-102's went down from the TANG in Nam? ZERO, how many photo planes
from the 460th during the same time? 54%. You don't get a medal for
falling off the bar stool at a Texas ANG O-Club you know.
Post by John S. Dyson
Question: do you have proof that Al Gore had an honorable
discharge?
No more than Bush, in fact there as never been any proof he was even
even in the ANG at all. All the dem candidates released their papers
in the election, Bush did not. They said he'se stuff was burned in
the St Lousi fire which is a lie because RES/ANG records are not
archieved there. That's for regulars, the ANG stuff is at Randolf
AFB. In the Mid-90's all these records were digatized and can be
accessed from any terminal in the USAF or ANG. This project
(scanning) was done at Randolf and the Reserve/ANG Center at the old
Lowry AFB in the same building as the Air Force Accounting and Finance
Center (AFAFC) which is now called DEFAS ( http://www.dfas.mil/ )

Now if you'd like a peak theres paper work involved. Use the
following forms : AFAFC 640-141, AFAFC 610-12, AFAFC 0-183, AFAFC
540-38, AFHQ 0-2029, AFPMC Form 25

THOM
Post by John S. Dyson
John
Jez
2004-01-05 17:46:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
There is no evidence from respectable sources against Bush,
and Bush did leave the military with an honorable discharge.
Even if Bush did something wrong in his past, he is doing
VERY VERY good while protecting us now.
Yeah he was really on the ball on 9/11 wasn't he ?

Asshole !
--
Ho hum
Jez
"Few of us can easily surrender our belief that
society must somehow make sense. The thought
that the State has lost its mind and is punishing so
many innocent people is intolerable. And so the
evidence has to be internally denied."
- Arthur Miller
Thom
2004-01-05 23:18:08 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 5 Jan 2004 17:46:11 -0000, "Jez"
Post by Jez
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
There is no evidence from respectable sources against Bush,
and Bush did leave the military with an honorable discharge.
Even if Bush did something wrong in his past, he is doing
VERY VERY good while protecting us now.
Really? Is that why he ran away to Texas again during the Xmas
bombing season?

THOM
Post by Jez
Yeah he was really on the ball on 9/11 wasn't he ?
Asshole !
--
Ho hum
Jez
"Few of us can easily surrender our belief that
society must somehow make sense. The thought
that the State has lost its mind and is punishing so
many innocent people is intolerable. And so the
evidence has to be internally denied."
- Arthur Miller
Jeremy Martin
2004-01-06 00:33:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jez
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
There is no evidence from respectable sources against Bush,
and Bush did leave the military with an honorable discharge.
Even if Bush did something wrong in his past, he is doing
VERY VERY good while protecting us now.
Yeah he was really on the ball on 9/11 wasn't he ?
I agree. Bush should have been on all of those planes
simultaneously, and whipped the hijacker's ass with his bare
balls!

Oh, what I meant to say--Bush shouldn't have ignored Clinton's
handed-down plan to take down bin Laden. I hate Bush.


--
Jeremy Martin
Pat
2004-01-05 19:46:29 UTC
Permalink
Bush didn't get close to the place.
--
Pat
***@att.net

Blessed are the flexible......
for they shall not be bent out of shape.
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Al Gore took pictures, with personal security, in Vietnam
George Bush put on his uniform and learned to fly a plane
in the National Guard.
Dishonest sites like those against Bush don't do justice to
the fact that it is clear that Al Gore took pictures, had
his own security, yet claimed that he saw action (but through
a lens.) Maybe Al Gore saw action through the lens of his
camera, or perhaps participated in 'action' in entertainment
districts?
George Bush did learn to fly a plane (while it is probable that
Al Gore didn't have the physical/mental ability to fly a plane.)
Al Gore was even given a security team to take care of him
(probably drove him around Saigon or even the various entertainment
facilities.)
There is no evidence from respectable sources against Bush,
and Bush did leave the military with an honorable discharge.
Even if Bush did something wrong in his past, he is doing
VERY VERY good while protecting us now. He has even compensated
for the sins that the dishonest Demwits claim that he has
done.
BTW, for the issue of discharges -- I don't even want to
think about BJ Clinton's infectious discharge.
John
John S. Dyson
2004-01-05 20:26:54 UTC
Permalink
Bush didn't get close ...
Bush flew a plane during the Vietnam war. Al Gore
took pictures during the war, but the 'action' that
he saw was most likely in entertainment districts.

John
JTEM
2004-01-05 21:39:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Bush flew a plane during the Vietnam war.
Well Poppy pulled some strings to get him into an
already full national guard unit, so Dubya could
dodge the draft, but then Dubya had to desert the
guard because they started drug testing.

It's all right here, including signed affidavits from
people who were present:

http://www.awolbush.com

With "President" Bush as an inspiration, we'll be
seeing a lot of desertion in our military soon...
DemsHaveNoFriends
2004-01-05 22:40:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by JTEM
With "President" Bush as an inspiration, we'll be
seeing a lot of desertion in our military soon...
Yeah, you could see it on the faces of our soldiers when he walked into that
room in Baghdad recently. They climbed up on their chairs, whistled,
yelled, stamped their feet, cheered, and took pictures of their Commander in
Chief. Anybody with half a brain quickly realized "There's a bunch of
soldiers who are ready to desert!"
John S. Dyson
2004-01-05 23:59:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by JTEM
Post by John S. Dyson
Bush flew a plane during the Vietnam war. Al Gore
took pictures during the war, but the 'action' that
he saw was most likely in entertainment districts.
Well Poppy pulled some strings to get him into an
Yes, Al Gore's VERY RACIST dad protected him...
You know, Algor took pictures during the Vietnam
war, but so did Jane...

Do you have proof of an honorable discharge for Al Gore?

John
JTEM
2004-01-06 00:03:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Yes, Al Gore's VERY RACIST dad protected him...
If you call sending him to Vietnam as Bush got stoned
& deserted his unit "Protecting Him."

Would you rather our men in uniform look to Al Gore
for inspiration, or a deserter who first dodged the
draft then refused to report for duty?

If they follow Bush's example, Al Qaida will own Texas
inside of a year.

I suppose congratulations are in order, chicken shit.
Cleopatra
2004-01-06 03:04:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by JTEM
Post by John S. Dyson
Yes, Al Gore's VERY RACIST dad protected him...
If you call sending him to Vietnam as Bush got stoned
& deserted his unit "Protecting Him."
Would you rather our men in uniform look to Al Gore
for inspiration, or a deserter who first dodged the
draft then refused to report for duty?
If they follow Bush's example, Al Qaida will own Texas
inside of a year.
I suppose congratulations are in order, chicken shit.
JTEM, a liberal democrat complaining about someone getting stoned
carries with it about as much credibility Ted Kennedy lecturing the
rest of us on drunk driving and the immorality of manslaughter. Nice
try! *Cleopatra*
JTEM
2004-01-06 04:10:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Cleopatra
JTEM, a liberal democrat complaining about someone
getting stoned carries with it about as much credibility
Ted Kennedy lecturing the rest of us on drunk driving
and the immorality of manslaughter.
Better to hear it from Laura Bush. After all, her "Manslaughter"
experience turned out to be quite the career-enhancing move.

Who could imagine that the Whitehouse could be only one
dead ex-boyfriend away!
qwerty
2004-01-06 00:25:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
Post by John S. Dyson
Bush flew a plane during the Vietnam war. Al Gore
took pictures during the war, but the 'action' that
he saw was most likely in entertainment districts.
Well Poppy pulled some strings to get him into an
Yes, Al Gore's VERY RACIST dad protected him...
BS. Sorry, but Gore Sr was a supporter of Civil Rights.

Albert Gore Sr had a 32-year-long Congressional career (1948-1970) as
a prominent advocate of civil rights, against bitter opposition.

http://janus.mtsu.edu/gore/gore_bio.htm
http://www.cnn.com/US/9812/06/gore.senior.obit.01/


When the 1964 Civil Rights Act was proposed, Gore objected to the
less-prominent provisions that allowed withholding federal funds
for schools and hospitals from non-complying states. He offered an
amendment to delete these provisions, saying that children and the
sick should not be penalized for the actions of healthy (but bigoted)
adults. He was willing to vote for the Act if it would be so amended.

His amendment was defeated, so he voted against the Act. He went on to
vote for the the 1965 Voting Rights Act and the 1968 Open Housing Act,
opposed Strom Thurmond's segregationist "Southern Manifesto", spoke out
against the conduct of the Vietnam War. He was an inspiration and role
model to the socially conscious youth of the South.

http://spider.georgetowncollege.edu/htallant/border/bs10/mitchell.htm


"Albert Gore is perhaps best-remembered by Tennesseeans for his stand on
Civil Rights. His refusal to sign the Southern Manifesto and his support of
almost all the Civil Rights acts during his tenure angered and alienated
many Tennesseeans and Southerners in this period of massive resistance. Gore
was a self-styled southern moderate, not a radical or liberal; however, as
Gore admits, "this hot and rancid political stuff was an open invitation to
extremism, which made moderation a hazardous political course." While Gore
voted against the Civil Rights Act of 1964, he supported every other piece
of Civil Rights legislation from 1953 to 1970. His "no" vote came only after
his amendment opposing cut-off of federal funds to schools and hospitals
failed. As a former teacher and school superintendent, Gore felt he could
not support legislation that would penalize children and the sick for
bureaucratic failure to comply."
Jeremy Martin
2004-01-06 00:34:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Bush didn't get close ...
Bush flew a plane during the Vietnam war. Al Gore
took pictures during the war, but the 'action' that
he saw was most likely in entertainment districts.
Which is, of course, something that you have no knowledge of and
can only speculate. Good show!


--
Jeremy Martin
DemsHaveNoFriends
2004-01-05 20:20:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Pat
Bush didn't get close to the place.
I think we are all willing to stipulate that Jane Fonda got physically
closer to Vietnam than Bush did, yes. But what's your point?
JTEM
2004-01-05 21:36:15 UTC
Permalink
Dishonest sites like those against Bush [...]
http://www.awolbush.com

Feel free to point out a single error, a single inaccuracy.

They have signed affidavits from people who were there,
saying Bush never reported for duty as ordered.

Are you calling our men in uniform "Liars"?

Killing our service men isn't enough? Ordering then to die
isn't enough, you now must demand that they destroy their
own reputations in order to defend a deserter?

You're a traitor. You belong in Gitmo along with the other
militants attacking our nation.
Yang
2004-01-06 03:07:13 UTC
Permalink
http://www.motherjones.com/news/outfront/1997/11/sipple.html

A Spin Doctor Responds

November/December 1997 Issue











Subscribe to Must Reads Today

Each Friday, we gather the best of our Mother Jones Daily web-logs
into a single listing of truly "must read" articles.

Read a Sample






















Following our story reporting allegations that top Republican
consultant Don Sipple had beaten his two ex-wives ("The True Character
of a Spin Doctor?" September/October), several notable events
occurred. First, Sipple resigned from Vito Fossella's New York
congressional race after pressure from New York Democrats. Then Texas
Gov. George W. Bush, a former client, said he would reconsider whether
to use Sipple in the future, saying, "This is something I'm taking
very seriously." Finally, longtime client Sen. Kit Bond (R-Mo.)
announced he would not use Sipple for his 1998 campaign.

Sipple responded to the article by filing a $12.6 million libel suit
in Los Angeles Superior Court against reporter Richard Blow and Mother
Jones, charging that the abuse allegations are "false and defamatory."
Mother Jones, meanwhile, stands by the story. After it was published,
both of Sipple's ex-wives issued statements supporting the accuracy of
the article. [Editor's Note: Judge threw out Sipple's suit against MJ
on October 30.]

The article has also sparked considerable press attention, including
favorable reactions from some conservatives (e.g., Arianna Huffington)
and, not surprisingly, less-than-favorable reviews from Sipple's
fellow political consultants. Here's a sampling:

"So we have Sipple, a moral cripple, choosing what issues matter most
and 'intuiting' our concerns. And then we wonder why voters are
cynical and leadership absent."
-- Arianna Huffington, in her syndicated column

"Trust me, I was no angel in my private life. But does that say
anything about the candidates who hired me?"
-- Democratic consultant James Carville, in a column for Salon

"Political consultants have become the paparazzi of modern American
politics. They pursue candidates.... They commission negative
opposition research reports to dig up every sin, major and minor, that
the candidates have ever committed. And I think, frankly, this is just
a little bit of justice."
-- University of Virginia political science professor Larry Sabato, on
CNN's "Inside Politics"

"[The allegations were] a surprise. You know, in my business with Don
Sipple, he was just a very quiet, mild-mannered guy."
-- former Sipple client Bob Dole, on CNN's "Inside Politics"

"A consultant has a responsibility in each individual relationship
with the candidate for whom they're working to recognize if there's
anything in their history that will potentially hurt their candidate,
and be honest about that."
-- Democratic strategist Kiki Moore, on CNBC's "Hardball"

"It is fair game if you have a past that is flamboyant, or strange, or
abhorrent."
-- Republican consultant Jim Innocenzi, on Fox News' "Fox on Politics"


"I think the problem is that when Don Sipple was doing Dole's campaign
none of this came out. It was after the fact, and obviously someone
went out to get him."
-- GOP consultant Ed Rollins, on CNN's "Crossfire"

"Don Sipple's not on the ballot anywhere. Don Sipple's not running for
anything. Don Sipple is a salesman."
-- Republican consultant Alex Castellanos, on CNBC's "Hardball"

"We have this genre now...of the political consultant and/or pollster
to the president -- who is in effect a member of the staff -- giving
him all sorts of substantive advice, and yet there's no
accountability."
-- Political journalist Elizabeth Drew on CNN's "Inside Politics"



-----

Yang
a.a. #28
a.a. pastor #-273.15, the most frigid church of Celcius nee Kelvin
EAC Econometric Forecast and Socerey Division
Proudly plonked by Lani Girl and Crazyalec

The Bush 'balanced' budget: -525 billion and worsening
The Bush 'economic' policy: -3 million jobs and counting
The Bush Iraq lie: -484 GIs, one friend's co-worker's son and mounting

Having Bush fuck up my country: Worthless
Yang
2004-01-06 03:07:10 UTC
Permalink
http://www.tylwythteg.com/enemies/roche.html

While championing family values, former Hillsdale President George
Roche III was sleeping with his daughter-in-law!

It used to be that Hillsdale College thought its curriculum built
character and a respect for Christian "Family Values". Maybe it
still does, no thanks to the disgraced George Roche III, who in
forcibly retiring has turned his institution into a school for
scandal. Roche, so far as anyone knows, wasn't a graduate of the
school. And from the looks of it, he was too busy on other fronts to
even audit a single class. He also had a Dean Smith complex, as seen
in his having the college's athletic facility named after himself. If
there's any lesson here it's that a creepy man who raises hundreds of
millions of dollars sooner or later starts to see himself as the
second coming of Donald Trump. The always saintly Al Hunt of CNN's
Capital Gang named Roche his outrage of the week, calling "this
long-time hero of the political right" an "all star" hypocrite who
"makes Newt Gingrich look good."

For nearly the past three decades Mr. Roche has made tiny Hillsdale
College the darling of the American conservative movement by
championing morality, Judeo-Christian principles, and right-wing
philosophy. During much of that time Hillsdale forsook all claims to
federal financial aid both for itself and for its students. Roche,
himself, brought in more than $324 million in private contributions.
To a large extent Mr. Roche was Hillsdale College. According to
reports in the Chronicle of Higher Education and National Review
Online, he ruled the place with an iron hand.

The reason for Mr. Roche's downfall lies in a messy conflict between
his publicly stated positions on morality and his personal behavior.
In November 1999, another right-wing wolf cloaked in family values
sheepskin was unzipped to the American public. George Roche III
resigned as president of conservative Hillsdale College in Michigan
after accusations of a quasi-incestuous relationship with his
daughter-in-law, Lissa. Although no public acknowledgment has been
given, it was widely rumored on the campus that President Roche had
conducted a 19-year-long illicit affair with his daughter-in-law Lissa
Jackson Roche. Ms. Roche was a college employee who had major
responsibility for the publication of its well known journal of
conservative thought, Imprimis. Lissa Roche was married to President
Roche's son George Roche IV (on campus Roche IV is known simply as
I-V), who is a history professor on the campus.

Apparently not content with his 19-year dalliance with his
daughter-in-law, President Roche decided to divorce his wife of 44
years so that he could marry one Mary Hagan. According to a story by
John J. Miller in National Review Online, the impending union between
Hagan and President Roche caused Lissa Roche severe distress - to the
point where she left I-V for a day or two before the wedding. The
relationship between President Roche and his new wife seems to have
gotten off to a rocky start. On October 15, 1999 he informed Lissa
and I-V that he was going to dump Hagan. Lissa was ecstatic at this
news.

The next day President Roche, a lifelong diabetic, suffered an insulin
reaction. At the hospital I-V learned that his father had reconciled
with his new wife. When informed of this, Lissa is reported to have
said "Oh, shit, oh, no."

On the 17th of October Lissa was in a highly emotional state, and had
threatened suicide in a phone call to President Roche who was still in
the hospital. On the morning of Oct. 17, 42-year-old Lissa and her
husband, George Roche IV, visited the 64-year-old Roche at the
hospital, where he was undergoing treatment for diabetes. With her
husband and father-in-law and the new Mrs. Roche as witnesses, Lissa
claimed that she and the elder Roche had been off-and-on lovers for 19
of the 21 years she and her husband had been married. According to
the National Review Online story, I-V is quoted as saying President
Roche "didn't say a word..." at that time, although later he denied
Lissa's claim while at the same time refusing I-V's request to leave
Hillsdale so that he and Lissa could start over. Lissa returned to
her campus house after the confession and armed herself with a
.38-caliber handgun. She walked out of her backyard and through the
college's arboretum to a stone gazebo, a secluded location where
students once went to relax, guzzle a few beers or liaise with members
of the opposite sex. There, Lissa ended her life.

Needless to say, these events shook the Hillsdale College campus to
its very core. Following meetings between the college board of
trustees and a very upset I-V, President Roche was forced into
retirement on November 10th.

"We have proved that integrity, values and courage can still triumph
in a corrupt world," he wrote in his letter of resignation. "Hillsdale
College is a monument to those beliefs." His statement made no
reference to the firestorm raging at Hillsdale.

Roche is rumored to have bailed out with a golden parachute. The
college refuses to confirm the amount of his retirement package, but a
member of the Roche family puts the figure at $3 million.

The fallout from Roche's spectacular blowup has stunned the
conservative movement. During Roche's tenure from 1971 to 1999,
Hillsdale College -- in the words of William F. Buckley Jr. -- "became
the most prominent conservative college in the country." Roche was a
movement hero, adored by his followers for savaging a system of higher
education hopelessly infested by government money and political
correctness. He was propelled to right-wing stardom after the Supreme
Court's 1984 Grove City decision, which ruled that colleges enrolling
students who used Pell grants, veterans' benefits and other forms of
government aid were "recipient institutions." Grove City forced all
recipient institutions to
comply with Title IX provisions, which prohibited sex discrimination.

Grove City would have allowed the government to monitor the race, age,
sex and ethnic origins of Hillsdale's employees and students, which
was ideologically unacceptable to Roche and Hillsdale's conservative
backers. To keep the government off its back, Hillsdale announced it
would no longer admit students receiving government aid, thereby
eliminating itself as a recipient institution.

Roche figured that Hillsdale's refusal to accept students with
government funding would attract big money, enough to replace the
government's cash with private aid. By all accounts, Roche excelled at
coaxing conservative fat cats to open their wallets for Hillsdale. A
former senior-level employee of Hillsdale calls him "one of the great
fund-raisers in the history of political ideologies." Roche had hauled
in nearly $325 million by the time he resigned -- enough to increase
Hillsdale's endowment from $4 million to $184 million, build modern
facilities and provide ample student aid to any of Hillsdale's 1,200
students who needed it. If Roche seldom made rounds on campus, it was
understood: He was out raising money to beat back the liberal devils
lurking outside Hillsdale's gates.

Conservatives were delighted with their school, which they referred to
as the "bastion of freedom," the "citadel of conservatism," the "city
upon a hill." They praised its traditional Great Books curriculum.
And, as the student body became more hardcore Christian right, some
may even have sung hallelujahs to God for sending George Roche III to
Hillsdale College.

This attitude has understandably softened a bit since the Lissa affair
went down. While Roche says he's innocent, it would take hard work to
fill a country church with believers. Hillsdale supporters may now
deem George Roche a lecherous beast cloaked as a family-values
conservative, casting him with the lot of Dick Morris and Henry Hyde.
Reflecting on the news coming from Hillsdale, Chicago Tribune
columnist John McCarron wrote, "It was enough to make a secular
humanist believe in divine retribution."

Roche had syndicated several ethics oriented columns just before the
story broke. It makes for somewhat poignant reading. For example, one
of his columns under the general heading "Views From a Heartland
Campus" is subheaded: "The Importan e of Moral Standards."

"In an age increasingly removed from any fixed standards or individual
codes of conduct, removed, indeed, from the individual capacity to
choose, we must take a hard look at the source from which ethical
systems derive their author-ity," writes Roche, who certainly comes on
as a windbag, even if his hypocrisy is only alleged.

In what could be read as a dig at President Clinton, Roche states that
we live in an age when men often no longer acknowledge any spiritual
authority. He thinks that the separation of church and state doesn't
mean the exclusion of religious values from the educational system.

"A fixed moral code in no way limits individual freedom of choice,"
Roche argues. "People without moral codes are free from moral problems
in exactly the same way that people who have never learned to count
are free from mathematical problems."

There's more of these "heartland views" from the pious Dr. Roche. It's
all neatly word-processed and camera-ready to go in the newspaper. But
we can't get past the idea of his poor, dead daughter-in-law maybe
helping him prepare the material and reading it with him as they labor
to get his message out to the great unwashed.

For many who have dealt with Roche, the Lissa affair is simply the
crowning hypocrisy of his reign. "This man," says one Hillsdale
professor, "is a phony and a fraud." The Roche family member explains,
"He's not really the type of person that everybody thinks he is. He's
kind of like a Jekyll and Hyde." Roche had a reputation for possessing
a free-range phallus rumored to have visited students and college
employees. The senior-level employee who marveled at Roche's
fund-raising skills claims to have fled Hillsdale when he suspected
Roche was putting the moves on his wife. Roche was considered
downright ruthless by those unfortunate enough to cross him.

"What a study in the use of almighty power," says another Hillsdale
professor. "The meanness and the spite of Roche are beyond any human
being I've seen." In a 1996 interview with the Detroit Free Press,
Hillsdale spokesman Ronald Trowbridge told the paper that Hillsdale's
trustees "think George walks on water." In other words, Roche could do
whatever the hell he wanted -- like allegedly screw his son's wife for
19 years -- as long as it didn't embarrass the school.

The result of Roche's attitude was students and professors who claim
they were unjustly kicked out of Hillsdale. The most prominent example
is Mark Nehls. According to Hillsdale officials, Nehls got the boot in
1991 for improperly signing a business contract while he served as
treasurer of a student organization. Over the years, the school's
explanation for expelling Nehls has evolved. Trowbridge told the
Detroit Free Press that Nehls was expelled for misrepresenting his
off-campus newspaper, the Hillsdale Spectator, as an official school
publication. The school has always denied that it expelled Nehls
because of the Spectator, which ran editorials illustrating how
Hillsdale was a land of hypocrisy. But the school's denials, which
have evoked laughter and mutterings of "bullshit," have never carried
much weight among those at Hillsdale. According to Nehls, "Everyone
with enough awareness to realize the United States was carpet-bombing
Iraq knew I was expelled for publishing the Hillsdale Spectator."

Students at Hillsdale can't protest or disseminate literature without
administrative approval. And the student newspaper is censored by the
administration. Dean Carol Ann Barker was the designated censor while
I worked for the Collegian, Hillsdale's student newspaper. She killed
a piece that argued Hillsdale needed a faculty senate. Editors were
also warned not to print the names of professors who had
"disappeared," meaning their contracts were terminated.

"It's a legal matter," Barker told Lingua Franca in a 1996 interview
about her censoring duties. Barker implied that such censorship was
necessary to avoid potentially libelous stories and that students were
ignorant of liability law.

"The stated reason is often lawsuits," said David Bobb, who edited the
Collegian in 1995. "The unstated reason is embarrassment to the
institution." Indeed, Hillsdale's imitation of Pravda was enough to
make some conservatives wonder if a state university swarming with the
most rabid breeds of feminists, multiculturalists and gays could be
any worse.

Hypocritical, holier-than-thou platitudes are de rigueur for Roche,
who pocketed one of the nation's highest salaries for a college
president. In 1999, Forbes magazine reported that Roche's total
1997-98 compensation package came to $524,000. Yet in his 1994 book
"The Fall of the Ivory Tower," Roche points to generous presidential
salaries as an example of corruption in higher education. "In 1990-91,
at least three universities paid their presidents more than $400,000 a
year in salary and benefits," complains Roche, "and twelve paid more
than $300,000."

Critics also claim Roche mythologized some aspects of Hillsdale's past
in order to attract donors. The most serious allegation -- that Roche
lied about Hillsdale taking direct government funding -- was made by
Robert G. Anderson, a professor at Hillsdale during the first two
years of Roche's presidency. Roche "began a publicity crusade, both in
written advertisements and public speaking, declaring that the college
had never accepted 'one cent of government funds in its entire
history,'" writes Anderson in "George and Me," an essay published at
LewRockwell.com. Roche "knew, and he knew we knew, that this was a
lie."

Hillsdale spokesman Frank Maisano admits the school participated in a
work-study program from 1969 to 1977. Hillsdale received only a "small
amount of dollars, mostly for low-income families," stresses Maisano.
Even so, Hillsdale's participation in the program overlaps a period in
which Roche proclaimed to the world that Hillsdale was free of the
government's tainted money.

As a committee made up of trustees, William F. Buckley and others,
seeks a new president, Hillsdale's conservative critics warn that the
scandal isn't over yet. "Central Hall [the college's administration
building] must be reformed before any real change will take place at
Hillsdale," says Marc Kilmer, a 1999 Hillsdale graduate. "The problems
were much deeper than George Roche." Indeed, tyrants like Roche
typically surround themselves with sycophants, henchmen, cowards and
other lowlifes. Until Roche's boys are flushed out of Hillsdale
College, the school will continue to be a boil on the conservative
movement.

The Religious Freedom Coalition finds the goings on at Hillsdale
College more than a bit strange. It's hard to imagine that neither
Lissa's husband, nor anyone on the college board of trustees had a
clue that President Roche and his son's wife were carrying on an
affair for 19 years. Generally, we feel that private relationships
between consenting adults should remain private. However, if one plays
that game there should be a few rules. First, it is extremely bad form
to have such a relationship with a subordinate employee. Colleges and
universities less independent than Hillsdale have rules against this
sort of hanky-panky. Second, it is even worse form to be playing
around with your son's wife, particularly if your son is also your
subordinate. The family that plays together doesn't necessarily stay
together. One doesn't need to be a $188,000 a year college president
to figure that one out.

If there is any good to come from this most sordid of affairs, it is
that the students at Hillsdale probably have learned a lesson in
Christian Pseudo-Ethics that they will not soon forget. Undoubtedly,
it's going to take some time for the campus to recover its
equilibrium. Those Judeo-Christian principles are a bit battered
right at the moment.




-----

Yang
a.a. #28
a.a. pastor #-273.15, the most frigid church of Celcius nee Kelvin
EAC Econometric Forecast and Socerey Division
Proudly plonked by Lani Girl and Crazyalec

The Bush 'balanced' budget: -525 billion and worsening
The Bush 'economic' policy: -3 million jobs and counting
The Bush Iraq lie: -484 GIs, one friend's co-worker's son and mounting

Having Bush fuck up my country: Worthless
Yang
2004-01-06 03:07:18 UTC
Permalink
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/3240756.stm

Divorce reveals Neil Bush secrets
George W Bush's brother Neil outlined business deals and admitted to
sexual liaisons with strangers in his divorce proceedings, a news
agency has said.
Neil Bush was to receive $2m in stock options from a semiconductor
firm despite having no education in the field, he told the court in
March.

He also said he had sex with women in Asia who had come to his hotel
room. He said they had not asked to be paid.

"It was very unusual," Mr Bush said in response to a lawyer's
question.

He told the court he did not know if they were prostitutes, the
Reuters news agency reported, saying it had seen a transcript of the 4
March deposition.

Neil Bush is now divorced from Sharon, his wife of 23 years.

He is the third child of former President George Bush and his wife
Barbara.

Silverado

He came under heavy criticism when a bank of which he was director
collapsed in the 1980s - and was bailed out by the government at a
cost of $1bn.


I personally would object to the assumption that they're investing $2m
in me
Neil Bush
on his contract with Grace
He denied wrongdoing in the failure of Silverado Savings & Loan, but
was fined $50,000 and banned from banking.
In the divorce proceedings, Sharon Bush's lawyer pressed him on why a
semiconductor firm would offer him $2m in stock.

Mr Bush signed a contract with Grace Semiconductor Manufacturing Corp
in August 2002.

The firm is backed by the son of former Chinese President Jiang Zemin.


Marshall Davis Brown, the lawyer, suggested Mr Bush had "not a lot of
demonstrable business experience that would bring about a company
investing $2m in you".

"I personally would object to the assumption that they're investing
$2m in me," Mr Bush replied.

He said has was acting as a consultant for the company and sitting on
its board of directors.

He added that he had not yet received stock from Grace.

Reuters said that Grace, Mr Bush and Mr Bush's divorce lawyer declined
to comment or were unavailable.


Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/americas/3240756.stm



-----

Yang
a.a. #28
a.a. pastor #-273.15, the most frigid church of Celcius nee Kelvin
EAC Econometric Forecast and Socerey Division
Proudly plonked by Lani Girl and Crazyalec

The Bush 'balanced' budget: -525 billion and worsening
The Bush 'economic' policy: -3 million jobs and counting
The Bush Iraq lie: -484 GIs, one friend's co-worker's son and mounting

Having Bush fuck up my country: Worthless
Yang
2004-01-06 03:07:21 UTC
Permalink
In 1981, Newt dumped his first wife, Jackie Battley, for Marianne,
wife number 2, while Jackie was in the hospital undergoing cancer
treatment

http://www.talkleft.com/archives/001276.html

"Gingrich's misbehavior goes back years. Fidelity was apparently never
his strong point. After marrying his high school math teacher,
Jacqueline Battley, even he admits: ''In the 1970s, things happened.''


"As a congressional candidate, he conducted an affair in 1977, a year
before enlisting Jackie to write a letter attacking his opponent for
planning to leave her family in the district: ''When elected, Newt
will keep his family together,'' declared one unintentionally
hilarious campaign ad. Gingrich ended his 19-year marriage shortly
after his victory."

"He famously visited Jackie in the hospital where she was recovering
from surgery for uterine cancer to discuss details of the divorce. He
later resisted paying alimony and child support for his two daughters,
causing a church to take up a collection. For all of his talk of
religious faith and the importance of God, Gingrich left his
congregation over the pastor's criticism of his divorce."



-----

Yang
a.a. #28
a.a. pastor #-273.15, the most frigid church of Celcius nee Kelvin
EAC Econometric Forecast and Socerey Division
Proudly plonked by Lani Girl and Crazyalec

The Bush 'balanced' budget: -525 billion and worsening
The Bush 'economic' policy: -3 million jobs and counting
The Bush Iraq lie: -484 GIs, one friend's co-worker's son and mounting

Having Bush fuck up my country: Worthless
Yang
2004-01-06 03:07:25 UTC
Permalink
http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/12/15/thurmond..paternity/

Strom Thurmond's family confirms paternity claim
From David Mattingly
CNN Washington Bureau


(CNN) --An attorney for the family of former U.S. Sen. Strom Thurmond
of South Carolina confirmed Monday that in 1925, when he was 22,
Thurmond fathered a child with a black teenage housekeeper.

Thurmond, the longest-serving senator in U.S. history, died in June at
age 100. His daughter's story was published Sunday by The Washington
Post.

Essie Mae Washington-Williams, a 78-year-old retired school teacher in
Los Angeles, California, revealed her relationship to the former
segregationist after decades of silence.

Thurmond ran for president in 1948 on the ticket of the States Rights
Party, the "Dixiecrats," a breakaway faction of Southern Democrats who
believed strongly in racial segregation and were opposed to the
Democratic Party's civil rights program.

He received 1 million votes and carried four Deep South states;
Democrat Harry Truman won the election.

Thurmond joined the Republican Party in the 1960s and ultimately
turned away from his segregationist past. (Thurmond's life and times)

Frank Wheaton, Washington-Williams' attorney, said she came forward at
the urging of her children and had no plans to ask the Thurmond estate
for any money, according to the Post.

Monday's statement from the Thurmond family reads: "As J. Strom
Thurmond has passed away and cannot speak for himself, the Thurmond
family acknowledges Ms. Essie Mae Washington-Williams' claim to her
heritage. We hope this acknowledgment will bring closure for Ms.
Williams."

The Thurmond family attorney, J. Mark Taylor, declined further
comment.

Glenn Walters, a South Carolina attorney also representing Williams,
told CNN he was happy that the matter had been resolved in this
manner.

Walters was reportedly prepared to provide documentation and undergo a
DNA test to prove her claim. Her attorney told CNN no DNA test was
done.

According to the Post report, Washington-Williams' mother, Carrie
Butler, worked as a maid at the Thurmond family home in Edgefield,
South Carolina.

At the time the girl was born in 1925, Butler was 16 and Thurmond was
22, unmarried and living in his parents' home.

Butler's sister took the girl to live in Pennsylvania when she was 6
months old. She did not meet Thurmond until returning to South
Carolina in 1941, when she was 16, the Post reported.

Her mother, who was ill and died a short time later, had insisted on
introducing her to Thurmond, who acknowledged her as his daughter, the
newspaper reported.



-----

Yang
a.a. #28
a.a. pastor #-273.15, the most frigid church of Celcius nee Kelvin
EAC Econometric Forecast and Socerey Division
Proudly plonked by Lani Girl and Crazyalec

The Bush 'balanced' budget: -525 billion and worsening
The Bush 'economic' policy: -3 million jobs and counting
The Bush Iraq lie: -484 GIs, one friend's co-worker's son and mounting

Having Bush fuck up my country: Worthless
Fair and Balanced Hyco-Limbaugh Fart Detector
2004-01-06 04:03:19 UTC
Permalink
when asked directly about this, the segregationist said it was "too
scandelous to merit a response"

The hypocritical segregationist voted (to the extent that he and not
his staff voted) to convict President Clinton on impeachment charges
years later.
Post by Yang
http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/12/15/thurmond..paternity/
Strom Thurmond's family confirms paternity claim
From David Mattingly
CNN Washington Bureau
(CNN) --An attorney for the family of former U.S. Sen. Strom Thurmond
of South Carolina confirmed Monday that in 1925, when he was 22,
Thurmond fathered a child with a black teenage housekeeper.
Thurmond, the longest-serving senator in U.S. history, died in June at
age 100. His daughter's story was published Sunday by The Washington
Post.
Essie Mae Washington-Williams, a 78-year-old retired school teacher in
Los Angeles, California, revealed her relationship to the former
segregationist after decades of silence.
Thurmond ran for president in 1948 on the ticket of the States Rights
Party, the "Dixiecrats," a breakaway faction of Southern Democrats who
believed strongly in racial segregation and were opposed to the
Democratic Party's civil rights program.
He received 1 million votes and carried four Deep South states;
Democrat Harry Truman won the election.
Thurmond joined the Republican Party in the 1960s and ultimately
turned away from his segregationist past. (Thurmond's life and times)
Frank Wheaton, Washington-Williams' attorney, said she came forward at
the urging of her children and had no plans to ask the Thurmond estate
for any money, according to the Post.
Monday's statement from the Thurmond family reads: "As J. Strom
Thurmond has passed away and cannot speak for himself, the Thurmond
family acknowledges Ms. Essie Mae Washington-Williams' claim to her
heritage. We hope this acknowledgment will bring closure for Ms.
Williams."
The Thurmond family attorney, J. Mark Taylor, declined further
comment.
Glenn Walters, a South Carolina attorney also representing Williams,
told CNN he was happy that the matter had been resolved in this
manner.
Walters was reportedly prepared to provide documentation and undergo a
DNA test to prove her claim. Her attorney told CNN no DNA test was
done.
According to the Post report, Washington-Williams' mother, Carrie
Butler, worked as a maid at the Thurmond family home in Edgefield,
South Carolina.
At the time the girl was born in 1925, Butler was 16 and Thurmond was
22, unmarried and living in his parents' home.
Butler's sister took the girl to live in Pennsylvania when she was 6
months old. She did not meet Thurmond until returning to South
Carolina in 1941, when she was 16, the Post reported.
Her mother, who was ill and died a short time later, had insisted on
introducing her to Thurmond, who acknowledged her as his daughter, the
newspaper reported.
-----
Yang
a.a. #28
a.a. pastor #-273.15, the most frigid church of Celcius nee Kelvin
EAC Econometric Forecast and Socerey Division
Proudly plonked by Lani Girl and Crazyalec
The Bush 'balanced' budget: -525 billion and worsening
The Bush 'economic' policy: -3 million jobs and counting
The Bush Iraq lie: -484 GIs, one friend's co-worker's son and mounting
Having Bush fuck up my country: Worthless
Yang
2004-01-06 03:07:27 UTC
Permalink
http://www.crimelibrary.com/notorious_murders/famous/smith/susan_3.html?sect=7

"[Bev Russel, a member of the] Republican Party, becoming a South
Carolina State Republican executive committeeman and a member of the
advisory board of the Christian Coalition.

At Susan’s trial, the caseworker testified that she had learned that
Bev Russell had on repeated occasions, fondled Susan’s breasts on top
of her clothing, french-kissed her and had taken Susan’s hand and
placed it on his genitals."


-----

Yang
a.a. #28
a.a. pastor #-273.15, the most frigid church of Celcius nee Kelvin
EAC Econometric Forecast and Socerey Division
Proudly plonked by Lani Girl and Crazyalec

The Bush 'balanced' budget: -525 billion and worsening
The Bush 'economic' policy: -3 million jobs and counting
The Bush Iraq lie: -484 GIs, one friend's co-worker's son and mounting

Having Bush fuck up my country: Worthless
Yang
2004-01-06 03:07:23 UTC
Permalink
http://www.schussman.com/archives/000278.html

Via Atrios comes the story of a high-profile GOP activist who pleaded
guilty to “production” of child pornography.

Delgaudio, who has no prior record, was arrested in November 2001 with
a book of obscene photographs he had taken of 15- and 16-year-old
girls, according to court documents. The teen-agers went with him on
several occasions to a hotel on Pulaski Highway, where they had sex
and he paid them to pose in erotic positions for his camera, records
show. The girls told Delgaudio their ages, according to police.

Let’s get this straight: Delgaudio is a predator who went to community
parks to meet underage girls, then on multiple occasions paid them to
have sex with him. That isn’t just “production of child pornography;”
it’s statutory rape. What sentence does this jackass pillar of the
community receive? Two years probation.

Isn’t that just precious? Fortunately, we’re told by one of
Delgaudio’s attorneys that Delgaudio is “brilliant and eloquent.” The
judge went out of his way to note that “This type of thing is a
mortifying experience.” You know what’s even more mortifying? Prison
sentences for child predators.

What else do we know about Delgaudio? It’s hard to find much, because
most of the websites pointed to by Google are down. Fortunately,
Google keeps caches. He’s the “author” of China Doll - Clinton, Gore
and the Selling of the U.S. Presidency and Peril in Panama (about the
takeover of the Panama Canal by Red China). Delgaudio was Chairman of
the Western Conservative Conference, where he was described as a “life
long conservative leader.” Back in 1998, Delgaudio was a prominent
advocate of Clinton’s impeachment:

Richard Delgaudio, president of the Legal Affairs Council, took that
request a step farther, warning Republicans who vote against
impeachment that they will be considered “deserters by all principled
GOP activists and voters now and in the future.”

“This is no time to break ranks,” he said.

Delgaudio was one of the “rule of law” thumpers who spit up so much
bile at Bill Clinton. Will Delgaudio, who called Clinton “a terrible
example to our nation’s young people,” continue his role as president
of the Legal Affairs Council? (An agency that raised over $300,000 for
Oliver North’s legal defense, rushed lawyers to aid Paula Jones, and
plans happy conservative field trips to the Reagan Museum.)

It’s not necessarily news that a prominent political activist turns
out to be a scumbag —- it’s not his particular kind of hypocrisy that
surprises me. But the slap-on-the-wrist consequences are a telling
reminder of the kinds of “moral clarity” we’re dealing with here.




-----

Yang
a.a. #28
a.a. pastor #-273.15, the most frigid church of Celcius nee Kelvin
EAC Econometric Forecast and Socerey Division
Proudly plonked by Lani Girl and Crazyalec

The Bush 'balanced' budget: -525 billion and worsening
The Bush 'economic' policy: -3 million jobs and counting
The Bush Iraq lie: -484 GIs, one friend's co-worker's son and mounting

Having Bush fuck up my country: Worthless
JTEM
2004-01-05 05:58:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Al Gore took pictures,
...while Bush took drugs... in Texas.

http://www.awolbush.com/
John S. Dyson
2004-01-05 21:48:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Al Gore took pictures,
Read George Magazine article:

Bush flew jets. Bush's CO clearly stated no drug
issue.

Al Gore played 'newspaper' man, and cut his military
career short.

Did Al Gore have an honorable discharge (unlike BJ Clinton's
green/yellow discharge?)

John
JTEM
2004-01-05 22:28:14 UTC
Permalink
Why?

There are thousands of articles in thousands more
publications. What counts though is the facts. Al
Gore put on his unifrom and went to Vietnam, while
I have scans of signed affidavits testifying to the
fact that Bush deserted his unit:

http://www.awolbush.com

And then there's the links to plenty of other major
media articles on the subject...
John S. Dyson
2004-01-06 05:18:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by JTEM
Why?
Because it is probably the closest to accurate information
that you'll find (not GOP nor extremist Dem biased.) Perhaps
you just don't want to know the truth.
Post by JTEM
There are thousands of articles in thousands more
publications.
Quantity isn't what counts -- there is alot of dishonest
spew. The most vehement spew comes from the emotional
democrat hatemongers. Perhaps that is your problem -- you
have no ability to distinguish and haven't learned to
critically read and think. You just accept whatever
the 100's of crackpots tell you... Hitler did take
advantage of alot of people like you.

John
JTEM
2004-01-06 06:24:35 UTC
Permalink
"John S. Dyson" <***@iquest.net> wrote
[---treason---]

Here you go: http://www.awolbush.com

If Bush wants to dispute a single word in here,
all he has to do is unseal his military record and
release it to the public.

Game over.

Thom
2004-01-05 12:15:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Al Gore took pictures,
So, did you know that photographers typically had the high est
casuality rate of any career field. I was a combat and recon
photographer, hit twice, decorated with the Gallentry Cross, the
bronze battle star and made 12+ jumps in Nam.

Put "combat photographer" in google then decide which of the 80,000
websites to go to but save yourself the trouble and go to
www.combatcamera.org and learb something besides what "Mainline Rush"
tells you.
Post by John S. Dyson
with personal security, in Vietnam
we all had security of some kind or another. What did you think we
did butthead, go out on our own and yell "here charlie charlie charlie
charlie!"
Post by John S. Dyson
George Bush put on his uniform and learned to fly a plane
in the National Guard.
God your stupid. the National Guard doesn't have any jets. I'll say
it real slow.... can you say AIR NATIONAL GUARD? I know you can.
Also pilots don't fly in their uniforms they wear flight suits.
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
While poor & middle class Americans sacrificed life &
limb over in Vietnam
Al Gore had personal security and carried a camera.
Yup, one of the mos dangerous fields in the military.
Post by John S. Dyson
Later on, Al Gore claimed that he saw action, thereby telling
a very disgusting lie. (Typical Clintonistic pervarication.)
Plkease provide a copy of his records to show he didn't. Now I know
you spent those years with long hair and a months supply of dope and
draft exemption excuses but EVERYONE in Nam saw action. There were no
lines, they were all around us. My first 3 months there they shelled
us every night, 19 rounds every night till they managed to knock out
the offending crew. And remember I was just like Gore...a
photographer.
Post by John S. Dyson
Both George Bush and Al Gore were honorably discharged.
Gore provided his DD-214, still waiting for Bush's
Post by John S. Dyson
Later on, Al Gore dishonored his military brothers by substantially
impeding the counting of military votes and also telling
substantial lies about his personal past.
And Bush is insulting every real vet by cutting the VA to pieces to
pay for his revenge on Saddam for making a fool of Daddy.

care to take it further and show your ignorance?

THOM
Post by John S. Dyson
John
DemsHaveNoFriends
2004-01-05 13:20:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thom
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Al Gore took pictures,
So, did you know that photographers typically had the high est
casuality rate of any career field. I was a combat and recon
photographer, hit twice, decorated with the Gallentry Cross, the
bronze battle star and made 12+ jumps in Nam.
Gore didn't do a single jump, except for the time when that prankster in his
battalion snuck up behind the doozing Al and yelled "Boo!"
redclay
2004-01-05 14:18:30 UTC
Permalink
DemsHaveNoFriends <***@DNC.com> wrote in message news:CwdKb.755692$***@attbi_s04...
And let us give the little spoiled rich kid his dues; not one Viet Cong set
foot in the state of Texas while little Goergie was on patrol. He was a
child of privilege and the rich can get favors granted to them. So he
avoided the overseas duty by getting into a National Guard unit. It
happened at lot back then and some units did get posted to rice paddies.
DemsHaveNoFriends
2004-01-05 14:24:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by redclay
And let us give the little spoiled rich kid his dues; not one Viet Cong set
foot in the state of Texas while little Goergie was on patrol.
And let us give the little self-righteous bigot Al Gore HIS dues: Gore
didn't so much as even aim his rifle at one single Viet Cong while he was on
patrol. In fact, it's not clear that he even aimed his camera at one of
them.
Brooks Gregory
2004-01-05 14:27:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by redclay
And let us give the little spoiled rich kid his dues; not one Viet Cong set
foot in the state of Texas while little Goergie was on patrol. He was a
child of privilege and the rich can get favors granted to them. So he
avoided the overseas duty by getting into a National Guard unit. It
happened at lot back then and some units did get posted to rice paddies.
QUESTION: "Mr. President, at some of our military camps, there have been
demonstrations by mobilized Reservists, including in one case an attempted
hunger strike. I wonder if you couldn't comment on these demonstrations, and
couldn't you give the Reservists some notion of when they might be
released?"

THE PRESIDENT: "Well, I understand the feeling of any Reservist,
particularly those who may have fulfilled their duty and then they are
called back. They see others going along in normal life, and therefore they
feel: how long are we going to be kept?

"We will release them at the first possible date consistent with our
national security. They were called up because of the crisis in Berlin, and
because of the threats in Southeast Asia. And I do not think that anyone can
possibly read the papers and come to the conclusion that these threats do
not continue. There is no evidence that we are going to quickly reach a
settlement in either one of these areas.

"These Reservists are doing a very important job. In my judgment, the fact
that they were called up, the fact they responded, has strengthened the
foreign policy of the United States measurably since last July and August.

"Now secondly, there is always inequity in life. Some men are killed in a
war, and some men are wounded, and some men never leave the country, and
some men are stationed is the Antarctic, and some are stationed in San
Francisco. It's very hard in military or in personal life to assure complete
equality. Life is unfair. Some people are sick and others are well.

"What I do hope is that these people recognize that they are fulfilling a
valuable function, and that they will feel, however humdrum it is, and
however much their life is disturbed and the years have been yanked out of
it, they will have the satisfaction afterwards of feeling that they
contributed importantly to the security of their families and their country
and at a significant time."

President's News Conference
John S. Dyson
2004-01-05 18:35:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by redclay
And let us give the little spoiled rich kid his dues; not one Viet Cong set
foot in the state of Texas
Bush didn't claim to have 'seen action in viet nam.' He certainly was
in one of the armed forces during the Vietnam war, however. Al Gore
was armed by a camera...

John
John Agosta
2004-01-05 18:34:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by redclay
And let us give the little spoiled rich kid his dues; not one Viet Cong set
foot in the state of Texas
Bush didn't claim to have 'seen action in viet nam.' He certainly was
in one of the armed forces during the Vietnam war, however. Al Gore
was armed by a camera...
John
In a place where bad people could shoot at him.
John S. Dyson
2004-01-05 20:30:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Agosta
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by redclay
And let us give the little spoiled rich kid his dues; not one Viet Cong
set
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by redclay
foot in the state of Texas
Bush didn't claim to have 'seen action in viet nam.' He certainly was
in one of the armed forces during the Vietnam war, however. Al Gore
was armed by a camera...
John
In a place where bad people could shoot at him.
Gore was probably in a brothel, seeing action there.

John
DemsHaveNoFriends
2004-01-05 20:26:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by John Agosta
In article
Post by redclay
And let us give the little spoiled rich kid his dues; not one Viet Cong
set
Post by redclay
foot in the state of Texas
Bush didn't claim to have 'seen action in viet nam.' He certainly was
in one of the armed forces during the Vietnam war, however. Al Gore
was armed by a camera...
John
In a place where bad people could shoot at him.
Gore was probably in a brothel, seeing action there.
Good point. I know Clinton steadfastly refused to release his medical
records, but did we ever see Gore's? I wonder if they show a record of
treatment for syphilis and such?
John S. Dyson
2004-01-05 23:17:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by John Agosta
In article
Post by redclay
And let us give the little spoiled rich kid his dues; not one Viet
Cong
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by John Agosta
set
Post by redclay
foot in the state of Texas
Bush didn't claim to have 'seen action in viet nam.' He certainly was
in one of the armed forces during the Vietnam war, however. Al Gore
was armed by a camera...
John
In a place where bad people could shoot at him.
Gore was probably in a brothel, seeing action there.
Good point. I know Clinton steadfastly refused to release his medical
records, but did we ever see Gore's? I wonder if they show a record of
treatment for syphilis and such?
I don't even care if Clinton and Al Gore had syphillis, as long as
they dont lie about it. Young people sometimes do stupid things, but
even older Democrats continually tell lies.

John
qwerty
2004-01-06 00:26:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by John Agosta
In article
Post by redclay
And let us give the little spoiled rich kid his dues; not one Viet
Cong
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by John Agosta
set
Post by redclay
foot in the state of Texas
Bush didn't claim to have 'seen action in viet nam.' He certainly was
in one of the armed forces during the Vietnam war, however. Al Gore
was armed by a camera...
John
In a place where bad people could shoot at him.
Gore was probably in a brothel, seeing action there.
Good point. I know Clinton steadfastly refused to release his medical
records, but did we ever see Gore's? I wonder if they show a record of
treatment for syphilis and such?
Clinton released his medical records! When is Bush going to release the
medical
record from the 'Pretzel' incident? What that Republican leader trying to
hide??
:

http://www.physweekly.com/archive/96/10_14_96/twf.html


Clinton's 1996 medical report listed gastroesophageal reflux among his
complaints, treated with 20 mg of omeprazole (Prilosec, Astra Merck) b.i.d.
and occasional antacids. His allergies to house dust, mold spores, cat
dander, and weed and grass pollen are treated with weekly desensitization.
He takes one to two tablets daily of loratadine (Claritin-D, Schering).
Occasional hoarseness is attributed to reflux, allergies, and voice overuse,
treated by voice rest.

A benign 5x5 mm epidermal inclusion cyst on the left side of his neck was
excised this summer. A 3x3 mm red macule on the right side of the nasal tip,
a precancerous actinic keratosis, was removed by liquid nitrogen. He does
stretching exercises to prevent low-back pain (chronic pars spondylolysis at
L5) that developed after a 1984 skiing accident, which also caused a
strained knee ligament. He has hearing loss at 3 kHz to 8 kHz. He had
successful sinus-window (Caldwell-Luc) surgery for sinusitis in 1979. As a
child, he had measles, mumps, and chickenpox, and he had a tonsillectomy in
1952.

He has no history of hypertension, diabetes, TB, STDs, cancer, stroke, or
heart disease. A PPD skin test was negative. A 1990 HIV test for life
insurance was negative.

The President was born Aug. 19, 1946. He is 6' 2" and weighs 216 lbs. His
pulse was 55 and regular, respiration was 18, and BP was 126/70 mm Hg. He
exercises with free weights two to three times a week and runs three miles
twice a week. He doesn't smoke. He drinks at social events.

PSA was 0.7. Urinalysis: yellow, clear, and negative for blood, mucous, or
WBC. Exercise treadmill: entered Stage VI Bruce protocol, 94% of predicted
maximum heart rate, no ischemic changes, no symptoms, test stopped by
physicians due to completion of greater than 90% maximum heart rate. ECG:
sinus bradycardia with rate of 55, normal.

CBC, fasting glucose, and blood chemistries were normal. T4: 7.5; TSH:
0.93. Total cholesterol: 191 mg/dL; triglycerides: 72; HDL: 36; LDL: 141;
lipid ratio: 5.3. Flexible sigmoidoscopy in 1994: negative. Hemoccult:
negative. -Mark Bloom
John S. Dyson
2004-01-05 21:52:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thom
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Al Gore took pictures,
So, did you know that photographers typically had the high est
casuality rate of any career field.
You mean a photojournalist (not spy) who hadn't really seen much action,
vs someone who flys a military plane? Note that the 'action' in
brothels don't count!!! (Flying fighter jets isn't known to be incredibly
safe.)

Question: do you have any proof that Al Gore had an honorable
discharge? We know that BJ Clinton probably had a green or yellow
discharge...

John
Thom
2004-01-06 02:29:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by Thom
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Al Gore took pictures,
So, did you know that photographers typically had the high est
casuality rate of any career field.
You mean a photojournalist (not spy) who hadn't really seen much action,
vs someone who flys a military plane? Note that the 'action' in
brothels don't count!!! (Flying fighter jets isn't known to be incredibly
safe.)
especially when your name is Bush and spaced out on booze and drugs.
Good thing they grounded him.

Combat photographers have the highest casuality rate (not numbers but
%) of any field. We were taught that in Tech school AND we had to go
to combat school before we shipped out (Mine was at Hamilton AFB) for
Nam. You remember Nam, the place Clinton, Bush, Cheney, Wolfoowitz,
Rummy etc etc avoided like the plague. Cluck cluck
cluck...CHICKENHAWK!!!!
Post by John S. Dyson
Question: do you have any proof that Al Gore had an honorable
discharge?
Do you have any proof Bush was ever even in the military? His records
seemed to be conveniently missing.
Post by John S. Dyson
We know that BJ Clinton probably had a green or yellow
discharge...
Funny how Republicans worry so much about Clintons penis and
appropriate fluids???

THOM
Post by John S. Dyson
John
John S. Dyson
2004-01-06 05:22:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thom
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by Thom
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Al Gore took pictures,
So, did you know that photographers typically had the high est
casuality rate of any career field.
You mean a photojournalist (not spy) who hadn't really seen much action,
vs someone who flys a military plane? Note that the 'action' in
brothels don't count!!! (Flying fighter jets isn't known to be incredibly
safe.)
especially when your name is Bush and spaced out on booze and drugs.
Refer to the George Magazine article (run by Democrat), and the
information is that Bush didn't have a drug problem on duty.
Post by Thom
Good thing they grounded him.
He decided not to continue training. The George Magazine
article told the whole story (it wasnt' BAD and it wasn't WONDERFUL.)
Honesty is something that is more foreign to the lefty democrats
nowadays than anything else. Just read the article.
Post by Thom
Combat photographers have the highest casuality rate
Photojournalists in a non-combat zone don't. Al Gore was
more likely to end up with a green or yellow discharge than
being wounded in combat.

John
Yang
2004-01-06 02:47:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Question: do you have any proof that Al Gore had an honorable
discharge? We know that BJ Clinton probably had a green or yellow
discharge...
And Neil Bush has multiple discharges, while GW when AWOL and drove
drunk, like his alcoholic daughters and Jeb Bush's druggie daughter.

But of course Democrats, unlike Republicans like George Roche III,
typically do not fuck their own daughter-in-law.


-----

Yang
a.a. #28
a.a. pastor #-273.15, the most frigid church of Celcius nee Kelvin
EAC Econometric Forecast and Socerey Division
Proudly plonked by Lani Girl and Crazyalec

The Bush 'balanced' budget: -525 billion and worsening
The Bush 'economic' policy: -3 million jobs and counting
The Bush Iraq lie: -484 GIs, one friend's co-worker's son and mounting

Having Bush fuck up my country: Worthless
John S. Dyson
2004-01-06 05:28:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Question: do you have any proof that Al Gore had an honorable
discharge? We know that BJ Clinton probably had a green or yellow
discharge...
And Neil Bush has multiple discharges...
Neil Bush isn't the president. However, BJ Clintons brother
really was a drug dealer (not just a user.) Who cares about
either? Did you know that significant amounts of the Delano
money (the D in FDR) came from selling (forced sale) of Opium
to China?

Should you blame the entire family for the flaws of others?

Should Al Gore be totally rejected because of the abuse
that his servants got from his racist dad? Do you realize
that Al Gore personally gained advantage from his Dads horrendous
and disgusting behavior? Should Al Gore be blamed for that,
or just his coup attempt against the constitution?

John
Arnold Wolfcaste
2004-01-05 18:51:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Under very controlled conditions. He was a army newspaper reporter
and his old man the KKK Senator from TN made sure Al never got
anywhere near the fighting. The old man made sure Albert Jr. was only
in country for a month at most during his hitch in JFK's Vietnam War.

Al Sr. would them parade Al jr. in uniform during campaign speeches.
Meanwhile, Al Gore senior was voting against the civil rights act for
blacks while Bush's granpappy, senator from CT, voted for it. Al Sr
was also shilling for JFK's Vietnam War and sending them poor white
and poor "negro" boys off to die for JFK & LBJ Vietnam War.

To this day - Al Gore Jr. washes his hands after touching black people
- he did it after touching Oprah and other blacks. He is a pothead
weirdo.
Jez
2004-01-05 19:02:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Arnold Wolfcaste
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Under very controlled conditions. He was a army newspaper reporter
and his old man the KKK Senator from TN made sure Al never got
anywhere near the fighting. The old man made sure Albert Jr. was only
in country for a month at most during his hitch in JFK's Vietnam War.
Al Sr. would them parade Al jr. in uniform during campaign speeches.
Meanwhile, Al Gore senior was voting against the civil rights act for
blacks while Bush's granpappy, senator from CT, voted for it. Al Sr
was also shilling for JFK's Vietnam War and sending them poor white
and poor "negro" boys off to die for JFK & LBJ Vietnam War.
To this day - Al Gore Jr. washes his hands after touching black people
- he did it after touching Oprah and other blacks.
He is a pothead
weirdo.
and sadly, your just another deluded moron.
--
Ho hum
Jez
"Few of us can easily surrender our belief that
society must somehow make sense. The thought
that the State has lost its mind and is punishing so
many innocent people is intolerable. And so the
evidence has to be internally denied."
- Arthur Miller
DemsHaveNoFriends
2004-01-05 20:20:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jez
Post by Arnold Wolfcaste
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Under very controlled conditions. He was a army newspaper reporter
and his old man the KKK Senator from TN made sure Al never got
anywhere near the fighting. The old man made sure Albert Jr. was only
in country for a month at most during his hitch in JFK's Vietnam War.
Al Sr. would them parade Al jr. in uniform during campaign speeches.
Meanwhile, Al Gore senior was voting against the civil rights act for
blacks while Bush's granpappy, senator from CT, voted for it. Al Sr
was also shilling for JFK's Vietnam War and sending them poor white
and poor "negro" boys off to die for JFK & LBJ Vietnam War.
To this day - Al Gore Jr. washes his hands after touching black people
- he did it after touching Oprah and other blacks.
He is a pothead
weirdo.
and sadly, your just another deluded moron.
And Gore is just another political has-been.

BTW, it's spelled "you're".
John S. Dyson
2004-01-05 20:37:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Arnold Wolfcaste
Post by JTEM
http://www.awolbush.com/
However, Al Gore tried to keep [...]
Al Gore put on his uniform and went to Vietnam.
Under very controlled conditions. He was a army newspaper reporter
and his old man the KKK Senator from TN made sure Al never got
anywhere near the fighting. The old man made sure Albert Jr. was only
in country for a month at most during his hitch in JFK's Vietnam War.
Your response so far is very accurate. I would take exception to
the implication that the Vietnam screwup was JFK's fault, because it seems
like it was more of a problem caused by LBJ/McNamara and crew.

For the most vehement hawks who might have misguidedly claimed that
using nukes would have solved the problem: NO!!! I read a true
classified (but de-classified) report on the use of nukes in Vietnam...
The kind of terrain and the kind of activities of the Cong, the
use of nukes would have made a horrible mess, but be only marginally
effective.
Post by Arnold Wolfcaste
Al Sr. would them parade Al jr. in uniform during campaign speeches.
Meanwhile, Al Gore senior was voting against the civil rights act for
blacks while Bush's granpappy, senator from CT, voted for it.
It is very clear that the Bush clan aren't perfect individuals, but
Gore Klan were alot less perfect.

John
DemsHaveNoFriends
2004-01-03 23:53:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by JTEM
Post by John S. Dyson
No, Harris was simply empowered to enforce Florida
election law, law that Bush signed & funded.
Yes -- in some sense.
In the "sense" that it was her frigging job! Is that what you
mean? It was her job to enforce all those election laws which
were broken.
Gore was lucky he didn't see jail time for his crime.
Ashland Henderson
2004-01-04 03:12:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Post by JTEM
Post by John S. Dyson
No, Harris was simply empowered to enforce Florida
election law, law that Bush signed & funded.
Yes -- in some sense.
In the "sense" that it was her frigging job! Is that what you
mean? It was her job to enforce all those election laws which
were broken.
Gore was lucky he didn't see jail time for his crime.
Which crime was that, Rene? Sounds like another little item
living only in the dark recesses of whatever it is that you
use for a mind.
John S. Dyson
2004-01-04 21:35:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ashland Henderson
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Post by JTEM
Post by John S. Dyson
No, Harris was simply empowered to enforce Florida
election law, law that Bush signed & funded.
Yes -- in some sense.
In the "sense" that it was her frigging job! Is that what you
mean? It was her job to enforce all those election laws which
were broken.
Gore was lucky he didn't see jail time for his crime.
Which crime was that, Rene?
I'll help: Being a traitor while attempting a coup against
the constitution. Using the legal system, where it has no
standing, to ascend to presidential power.

The Dimmies keep on thinking that the legal system IS the
government. Alas, the constitution is actually the
basis of the government, and the constitution doesn't really
give the judiciary the power to create or change law in
the way that Al Gore attempted.

Hint: the Florida Supreme Court doesn't have the authority
to interfere with the constitutional powers of the florida
legislature or the florida secretary of state. The florida
supreme court tried to CHANGE the interactions AFTER/DURING
the election, and that is a DIRECT VIOLATION of FEDERAL
law.

There are numerous other Gore inspired violations of
federal law and the constitution -- but I gave one example
that the Dimmies often try to discount (the SCOTUS involvement
in the illegal change of precedent by the Florida courts.)

Al Gore so badly f*cked up WRT the constitution, federal law
and state law in so many ways that the sum total of abuses
should result in life imprisonment or the death penalty. REALLY.

John
Ashland Henderson
2004-01-05 17:09:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by John S. Dyson
Post by Ashland Henderson
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Post by JTEM
Post by John S. Dyson
No, Harris was simply empowered to enforce Florida
election law, law that Bush signed & funded.
Yes -- in some sense.
In the "sense" that it was her frigging job! Is that what you
mean? It was her job to enforce all those election laws which
were broken.
Gore was lucky he didn't see jail time for his crime.
Which crime was that, Rene?
I'll help: Being a traitor while attempting a coup against
the constitution. Using the legal system, where it has no
standing, to ascend to presidential power.
Basic right-wing crap. The only coup I see was a possible one
by the SCOTUS. But then I'm not required to believe your theories
about what constitutes a coup.
Post by John S. Dyson
The Dimmies keep on thinking that the legal system IS the
government. Alas, the constitution is actually the
basis of the government, and the constitution doesn't really
give the judiciary the power to create or change law in
the way that Al Gore attempted.
Nor the way the SCOTUS attempted and succeeded at.
Post by John S. Dyson
Hint: the Florida Supreme Court doesn't have the authority
to interfere with the constitutional powers of the florida
legislature or the florida secretary of state. The florida
supreme court tried to CHANGE the interactions AFTER/DURING
the election, and that is a DIRECT VIOLATION of FEDERAL
law.
There are numerous other Gore inspired violations of
federal law and the constitution -- but I gave one example
that the Dimmies often try to discount (the SCOTUS involvement
in the illegal change of precedent by the Florida courts.)
Al Gore so badly f*cked up WRT the constitution, federal law
and state law in so many ways that the sum total of abuses
should result in life imprisonment or the death penalty. REALLY.
The usual rants from the usual ranter. Sorry, but your fixations do
not bind reality to your views. You'll just have to live with it.
Mr. N
2004-01-04 03:14:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by DemsHaveNoFriends
Gore was lucky he didn't see jail time for his crime.
What 'crime' is that?
--
-My Real Name
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